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Tangerine Retention Rates Q4 (Oct 4) 2017
October 6, 2017
10:39 am
duckgybe
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Just received Fall promo of 2.75% for both me and my wife. I had 465k with Tang that I pushed out to PC on Oct 2 and my wife also pushed out 451k to PC. Then on Oct 3rd we both pushed out the interest to PC so that the bal could be zero at the end of this business day.
Subsequently, we both pull funds back in on Oct 5th and we can continue to enjoy the game and the dance with Tang. It's so cool. This is our 3rd consecutive promo dance after 2.97% for Spring promo and 3.1% for Summer promo.
I love Tang!! sf-cool

October 6, 2017
11:18 am
Bill
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This thread isn't showing (just sometimes) when I access the site - is it too big? Is it something I'm doing? The other threads all are listed, not this one - ?

October 6, 2017
11:21 am
AlainJF
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Bill said
This thread isn't showing (just sometimes) when I access the site - is it too big? Is it something I'm doing? The other threads all are listed, not this one - ?  

It looks like, if the last post is "Awaiting Moderation", the thread gets remove from the main list.

You have just fixed it !

October 6, 2017
11:27 am
AlainJF
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DavidAlta13 said
If you didn't get a Special Interest Rate offer and haven't called in to see if you can get the 2.5% on all money (not just new deposits) that others have received, today is your last day to do it and still have a chance for qualifying for the Jan 2018 offer:
Today's 2.5% offers will expire on Jan 3, the 2nd business day and"snapshot" date, so money will have to be out to chequing or another FI by the end of Jan 3.
It appears that if you have a 2.5% rate locked in past Jan 3, you may not get the Special Offer.  

I just called, wait and wait and wait, and finally reached a supervisor... Same answer as last week: "No Soup For You" (today). Nothing they can do (today).

He (sort of) suggested (not 100% clear) that I call back when my current offer is over (tomorrow).

I`ll check back in the next few days...

Thanks for all good advices here !

October 6, 2017
11:35 am
Bill
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AlainJF, seems to be the case! Aside from the quarterly offers, my experience has been if you call even a day before your current 90-day promo is up they won't talk to you about a new one. Have to wait until the first day you're off-promo, in my experience.

October 6, 2017
11:41 am
moneyhelp
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moneyhelp said

My logic is, to answer your original question, yes, it is worth it. As @fbeaulie and I pointed out, if it only takes 2 minutes of contacting them to see if they can improve on the 2% that was offered to me, then why not? and even if they don't offer me better than 2%, and even if Tangerine is laughing at me because they are giving me a paltry increase of 0.15%, I'll take it, because common sense dictates that logically 2%>1.85% then I'll take that $37 and buy a decent bottle of wine. sf-laugh

I plan to contact Tangerine tomorrow, I'll let you know how it goes!

Cheers!  

Well, chatted with Tangerine and the agent was not willing to budge past the 2%, oh well. Still transferred my $ though.

October 11, 2017
6:00 pm
GoHabs
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AlainJF said

I am not using them, but, unless I am wrong, DUCA is available for Quebec and it is covered by DICO.

Consequently, unless I am wrong, you do have a 2.75% option available in Quebec. (ref: https://www.highinterestsavings.ca/forum/tangerine-bank/tangerine-retention-rates-q4-oct-4-2017/page-9/#p25883 )

Question for the Forum Administrator: Why is DUCA not listed in the "Comparison Chart" of this forum ?  

Thanks for that info. I just browsed their site and it took 15-20 min for me to find 'insured' info and this is what I found:

The Deposit Insurance Corporation of Ontario, a government corporation, protects all Ontario credit union depositors up to a maximum of $100,000 of all Canadian dollar deposits. All deposits made to RSP plans are fully insured through the Deposit Insurance Corporation of Ontario with no limit on the maximum amount.

My first reaction was that only those in Ontario would be insured - although that's probably wrong, the way it's written leaves room for interpretation imo.

October 11, 2017
6:53 pm
Norman1
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GoHabs said

My first reaction was that only those in Ontario would be insured - although that's probably wrong, the way it's written leaves room for interpretation imo.  

Deposits are covered while one remains a member of the Ontario credit union, regardless of one's province of residence. This is from DICO's FAQ:

If I am a member and have deposits at an Ontario credit union/caisse populaire and I subsequently move out of province, are my deposits still covered by DICO?

Yes. Your deposits will remain protected while you remain a member of an Ontario credit union/caisse populaire.

October 11, 2017
8:12 pm
GoHabs
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Norman1 said

Deposits are covered while one remains a member of the Ontario credit union, regardless of one's province of residence. This is from DICO's FAQ:

If I am a member and have deposits at an Ontario credit union/caisse populaire and I subsequently move out of province, are my deposits still covered by DICO?

Yes. Your deposits will remain protected while you remain a member of an Ontario credit union/caisse populaire.

  

That clarifies things. Thanks for taking the time to post that, Norman1.

October 11, 2017
8:37 pm
GoHabs
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fbeaulie said

GoHabs said

(...)

I'm in QC and got 2.55% this time, down from 3.1%. Disappointing. I saw someone else in QC post they got 2.75% which surprised me since I think we tend to get lower offers here because of having less options.

In Quebec and I got 2.75% - I also got the highest rate last Spring. However, for the first time since April 2015, I did not get the "regular" promotional offer last Summer (likely not related, but I sent them a complaint in June about an issue that was not related to my savings accounts) - I finally got 2.5% after a 2-minute chat session.  

Appreciate your posting that, fbeaulie. If you don’t mind answering, can you share your balance in terms of high, medium or low x figures - e.g. high or medium 6 figures, etc.? Trying to crack the code to those getting higher rates - lol

Good on you for calling and coming away with a promo offer and at a decent rate.

Last year I was able to convince a supervisor to increase the promo rate I was offered. So I agree - it can be done. However I didn’t have the same success when I tried again earlier this year. So hit or miss, it seems.

October 12, 2017
8:28 am
fbeaulie
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GoHabs said

Appreciate your posting that, fbeaulie. If you don’t mind answering, can you share your balance in terms of high, medium or low x figures - e.g. high or medium 6 figures, etc.? Trying to crack the code to those getting higher rates - lol

 

Above $50K but below $100K for more than a year. Always almost $0 before promotional offer (all transferred to my Tangerine Checking Account).

Balance toward the end of a promotion period was usually higher than at the beginning. However, for Spring 2017: Balance at the end of the promotion period was about $20K lower than at the beginning (some renovations!). I did not get an "automatic" offer for Summer 2017.

October 12, 2017
10:25 am
marcob
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I got the 2.4% promo for both my wife and I. I transferred into my chequing just in time on Oct 2 to take advantage of the whole balance.

I have a TFSA GIC that will mature Oct 14. Once that enters the TFSA, is it safe to assume that counts as new money and I get 2.4% on it? What do you think?

October 12, 2017
11:59 am
DavidAlta13
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marcob said
I got the 2.4% promo for both my wife and I. I transferred into my chequing just in time on Oct 2 to take advantage of the whole balance.

I have a TFSA GIC that will mature Oct 14. Once that enters the TFSA, is it safe to assume that counts as new money and I get 2.4% on it? What do you think?  

It is not clear whether your 2.4% promo was one you got by calling in, which would apply to old and new balances, or by a special "Offer" based on new money on top of the Oct 2 balances.
If it was the latter, then according to my "Offer" terms, the TFSA GIC will NOT count as new money, or "Eligible Deposits " in Tang legalese.

I think of it this way: Tang calls Savings, RRSP's & TFSA's accounts "Applicable" accounts, and will pay the Additional interest on new (Eligible") deposits up to $500,000 per each of these three account types.
Existing GIC's in any of these are just that - existing, not new, deposits.
Transfers within each Applicable account type (like from one TFSA to another TFSA, or a TFSA GIC that matures) will not qualify as new deposits.
Also, any GIC bought with new money will receive only the GIC rate and not the Additional interest.

The legalese in my "Offer" says:
"The following transactions will be considered Eligible Deposits to which Additional Interest will apply:
"Money transferred ... to an Applicable Account: ... from a Tangerine Chequing Account (or) ... from another financial institution;
"Money transferred from a Savings Account into an Applicable TFSA Savings or RSP Savings Account."
"The following are not (emphasis added) considered to be Eligible Deposits and will not be eligible for Additional Interest:
"... Money transferred from a (Tangerine) Bank GIC, Investment Fund or Line of Credit to an Applicable Account."

Please check the details in your Offer in case the wording / terms are different.

October 12, 2017
2:01 pm
marcob
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Here are the terms online, its the fall promo. I had to read example 3 a few times, I still don't quite understand it. Unless they classify TFSA GICs the same as TFSA Savings. I guess I will know for sure on Nov 1st if it says bonus interest.

The Tangerine Bank (the “Bank”) Savings Interest Offer of 2.40% (the “Offer”) is available to existing Tangerine Clients who: (1) receive the Offer by email directly from the Bank; and/or (2) receive a notification that they are eligible to participate in the Offer when they log in on the Bank’s website (“Eligible Clients”).
The Offer is only available to Eligible Clients between October 4, 2017 and December 31, 2017(the “Offer Period”).
The Offer is only applicable to Tangerine Savings Accounts (“Savings”), Tangerine Tax-Free Savings Accounts (“TFSA Savings”) and Tangerine RSP Savings Accounts (“RSP Savings”) (herein referred to collectively as “Applicable Accounts”) where the Eligible Client is the Primary Account Holder as described in Section 17 below. A number of similar Applicable Accounts (for example, 3 separate TFSA Savings) is defined as an “Applicable Account Type”. The Offer is not applicable to any other Accounts, including (but not limited to) Tangerine RIF Savings Accounts (“RIF Savings”), Tangerine US$ Savings Accounts, Tangerine Business Savings Accounts, Tangerine US$ Business Savings Accounts, Tangerine TFSA Kick Start or Tangerine Children’s Savings Accounts (“CSA”).
“Additional Interest” is 1.40%. During the Offer Period, the Bank will calculate Additional Interest for new deposits to Applicable Accounts each time the sum of the daily balances in each Applicable Account exceeds the corresponding Applicable Account Type balance as at October 3, 2017 to a maximum of $500,000 per Applicable Account Type (“Eligible Deposits”). Additional Interest will only apply to net new Eligible Deposits that raise the Applicable Account Type balance above the October 3, 2017 balances and the balances in an Applicable Account Type that are equal to or less than the Applicable Account Type balances as at October 3, 2017 will not earn Additional Interest.
All balances in Applicable Accounts that are not eligible for Additional Interest will be paid the Bank’s applicable posted rate of interest listed on the Bank’s website (the “Posted Rate”).

Subject to the limits and qualifications outlined in these Terms and Conditions, Additional Interest will be calculated daily and paid monthly on Eligible Deposits made during the Offer Period into Applicable Accounts that were opened prior to the Offer Period, as well as Applicable Accounts that were opened during the Offer Period. For the purposes of this Offer, net new Eligible Deposits are determined based on the source of the funds, type of transaction, and the amounts relative to combined balances across all Applicable Account Types. Although all Applicable Account Type balances are used to determine whether a deposit is eligible for Additional Interest, Additional Interest is paid at the individual Account level based on the duration of time the Eligible Deposits are in each Applicable Account.
Example 1: Eligible Client has $10,000 in their existing TFSA Savings on October 3, 2017. Five days later, they transfer $5,000 to a new TFSA Savings from their Tangerine Savings Account. They also transfer $5,000 from their existing TFSA Savings to a TFSA GIC. The total of the balances in the TFSA Savings remains $10,000 after completing the transfers. Therefore Additional Interest doesn’t apply to the transfers to the TFSA Savings.
Example 2: Eligible Client has $10,000 in their existing TFSA Savings on October 3, 2017. Five days later, they transfer $10,000 to their existing TFSA Savings from their Tangerine Savings Account. They also transfer $5,000 from their existing TFSA Savings to a TFSA GIC. Their balance in the TFSA Savings is $15,000 after completing the transfers. Additional Interest will apply to $5,000 of the new deposit to the existing TFSA Savings.
Example 3: Eligible Client has $10,000 in their existing Tangerine Savings Account on October 3, 2017. Five days later, they open an additional Tangerine Savings Account and transfer $5,000 from their existing Tangerine Savings Account. Their Applicable Account Type balance remains $10,000 in total between both Tangerine Savings Accounts. The transfer to the new Tangerine Savings is not eligible for the Additional Interest because it does not qualify as a net new Eligible Deposit.

October 12, 2017
2:54 pm
DavidAlta13
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marcob, yes, Tang does classify TFSA GICs the same as TFSA Savings. Anything beginning with "TFSA" is totaled under what they call an Account Type, in this case the "type" being TFSAs.

Example: if you had $5,000 in your TFSA Savings and a $10,000 TFSA GIC, Tang would calculate your existing ("old") Account Type TFSA balance as $15,000. When the TFSA GIC matures and you then have $15,000 in the TFSA Savings and $0 in TFSA GICs, the Account Type TFSA balance is still $15,000. Since there are no new (Eligible) deposits, none of the TFSA money would get the promo rate.

For Tang's example 3, Tang is saying that if someone has multiple Savings accounts (not TFSA Savings or RRSP Savings, just plain Savings accounts), they classify all these multiple Savings accounts as a single Account Type. Tang uses the total of the deposits in all these Savings accounts to calculate the old balance. Then, if money is moved from one to the other, the grand total for Account Type "Savings" doesn't change, there's no new deposits.

This is why we have to move any money in Savings accounts out, to chequing or another FI: chequing accounts are a different Account Type than Savings, so any money outside the Savings account(s) is not counted in the Savings total, and so when it is moved back into Savings, they count it as new and pay promo interest on it.

There is no equivalent in a TFSA account, unless you do a withdrawal from the Tang TFSA to your chequing and back again. Since the Canada Revenue Agency doesn't add any TFSA withdrawals back to your TFSA limit until the following calendar year, you risk being penalized for going over your limit when you put it back.
The exception to this is every Dec / Jan: you can withdraw from the TFSA in late Dec and then put it back by re-contributing in early Jan, after the Dec withdrawal has been added back to your limit. So we're basically out of luck on getting promo rates on existing TFSA deposits except for the first quarter of each calendar year, IF we remember to make the withdrawal before the end of Dec.

We can get Tang promos on NEW TFSA contributions if they are made after the 2nd business day of a quarter, but only until the end of that quarter. Then we're out of luck again, until the next Dec/Jan when we can do the withdrawal / re-contribution as above.

October 12, 2017
7:21 pm
Saver-Mom
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I think we have named those actions the TFSA manoeuver and the Tang chequing account manoeuvre. Patents pending.

October 12, 2017
8:39 pm
GoHabs
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fbeaulie said

GoHabs said

Appreciate your posting that, fbeaulie. If you don’t mind answering, can you share your balance in terms of high, medium or low x figures - e.g. high or medium 6 figures, etc.? Trying to crack the code to those getting higher rates - lol

 

Above $50K but below $100K for more than a year. Always almost $0 before promotional offer (all transferred to my Tangerine Checking Account).

Balance toward the end of a promotion period was usually higher than at the beginning. However, for Spring 2017: Balance at the end of the promotion period was about $20K lower than at the beginning (some renovations!). I did not get an "automatic" offer for Summer 2017.  

Thanks for your post, fbeaulie. My usual balance is higher than $100k except when I pull everything or almost everything out at the end of a promo while waiting for a new offer.

I have this crazy theory that Tangerine gives a lower promo rate to accounts with higher balances because they don’t want to pay out so much in interest... What do others think? Do your personal offers support or contradict that theory?

October 12, 2017
9:52 pm
DavidAlta13
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GoHabs said

Thanks for your post, fbeaulie. My usual balance is higher than $100k except when I pull everything or almost everything out at the end of a promo while waiting for a new offer.

I have this crazy theory that Tangerine gives a lower promo rate to accounts with higher balances because they don’t want to pay out so much in interest... What do others think? Do your personal offers support or contradict that theory?  

Both support & contradict: this time I got the same as the highest I've seen from others, 2.75%; I got less than others in Q2 (2.37% vs .21%) & in Q3 (2.69% vs 3.22%).

I've given up on trying to figure it out.
What if it's SIN's? Age? Retired or working? Income? Duration as a customer?
Credit Rating? Marital Status? Number of kids, w or w/o Tang accounts? Height, weight or BMI? Sum of digits in postal code, with or without the letters converted to numbers? Different formulae for those w & w/o links to other accounts? First letter of surname?
What if it factors in Tang's forecast of the difference between their total non-promo deposits and their total 1 year mortgages, with a bigger shortfall leading to offering higher rates?
Please submit other crazy theories for GoHabs 🙂

I jest, in the hopes GoHabs may realize that the possibilities are endless. Collectively, there's no shortage of brains or experience among us, and as we haven't figured out how Tang's black box works yet, I rank the odds of doing so as slim to nil. Giving up on this potentially hopeless task may allow GoHabs to retain whatever degree of sanity is left.

October 13, 2017
5:44 am
marcob
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Thanks for the reply that clears that up, I thought I stumbled on a way to get higher interest on my TFSA money which would be more important to me than my savings.

I was planning on withdrawing on Dec 31 and then putting it back for at very least the January promo. That makes perfect sense. Too bad they charge money to transfer your TFSA to another institution. They are basically keeping your money hostage at a poor rate. Though most institutions don't offer great interest on TFSA accounts, they push you to mutual funds.

October 13, 2017
11:21 am
DavidAlta13
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marcob said
Thanks for the reply that clears that up, I thought I stumbled on a way to get higher interest on my TFSA money which would be more important to me than my savings.

I was planning on withdrawing on Dec 31 and then putting it back for at very least the January promo. That makes perfect sense. Too bad they charge money to transfer your TFSA to another institution. They are basically keeping your money hostage at a poor rate. Though most institutions don't offer great interest on TFSA accounts, they push you to mutual funds.  

For the year end TFSA withdrawal, it must be out by Fri Dec 29 for a 2017 date, so please double check w Tang about how many business days they need to process it. I don't know if it is the same day, or if it takes 1 to 10. As they may be short staffed over the holiday period, better safe than sorry.

For my RRSP / TFSA funds, I refuse to pay the high MER's for mutual funds. I use a ladder of EQ GIC's (yes, my TD Waterhouse account sells them) and some shares in two mortgage companies, First National (FN) and McCan (MKP). There are some good ETFs too, although the ones for the TSX have too much energy & materials for my liking. Maybe consider a financial one that owns all the banks? If your TFSA gets over $50K, and you don't have a brokerage account, consider opening one at your bank's associated brokerage. That gives you access to all the ETFs, EQ's GICs and individual stocks like BAM.A, BEP, BIP CNR, RY, TD.

Please write your comments in the forum.