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New Special Rate Offers
April 8, 2016
10:10 pm
Miron
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Peseta said

RRSP and TFSA transfer outs are now feed at $45!

These are not exactly 'fees' but rather 'fines' and most banks, including those on line, are charging them. The 'regular' banks are charging them 100%.

NSF fee was introduced a few months ago at $25

I never heard before today of any bank that was offering free NSF...

MasterCard charges a forex fee of 1.5%

I think that fee depends mostly on MasterCard... very few CC are free forex... being their first CC they could not get a better deal I guess... most CC are charging 2%

A free Whoops protection was substituted by conventional overdraft at 19% APR.

I never knew of that as I never use overdraft unless pure accidentally for 1 day... and pay a few cents.

So Tanga is slowly become just like any other bank. They can dress it up as "fair" fees, "lower" fees or "standard industry practice" fees, but the truth of the matter is that the vast majority of their clients are with them because they ran away from fees and those very standard industry practices. Its so unfortunate that they are quickly moving away from what they used to be.

Looking at these conditions you are pointing out, they were a unique bank indeed... lack of competition help them become just like any other bank... but I would add: just like any other ON LINE bank... still way better than all standard banks!

I am not in love with them anymore for a different reason: interest fees are as low as just any other bank... or lower. When some other bank is giving more, they start doing the same but in a much worse scenario... like this selective method and not For All like the others do... and this is not something new... it was used even before Scotia Bank took over.

They never had a proper ATM network so I can't use them for my daily banking needs!

April 8, 2016
10:17 pm
Miron
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dentgal said

Miron, they aren't just targeting those with low balances.
I have a high balance, and they offered me the 3%.
BUT the 3% is only on new funds and my existing funds will be at 0.8%.
When i explained that my NET rate would be less than 2% if i brought lots of new money, they offered 2% on my existing funds. So i won't give them any new money--it doesn't pay! But i'll keep the "old" money there for 2%!

Good, you tricked them sf-laugh

I guess the rules are pretty easy to be applied differently by any CSR sf-cool

We should call them as many times as possible until we reach the best CSR sf-embarassed

April 8, 2016
10:17 pm
Loonie
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dentgal said

Miron, they aren't just targeting those with low balances.
I have a high balance, and they offered me the 3%.
BUT the 3% is only on new funds and my existing funds will be at 0.8%.
When i explained that my NET rate would be less than 2% if i brought lots of new money, they offered 2% on my existing funds. So i won't give them any new money--it doesn't pay! But i'll keep the "old" money there for 2%!

Do I understand correctly that you were offered 2% on existing and 3% on new, and you don't think the latter pays? Or was it either/or?

April 9, 2016
2:01 am
Peseta
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Miron said

These are not exactly 'fees' but rather 'fines' and most banks, including those on line, are charging them. The 'regular' banks are charging them 100%.

Thats exactly what we need now: to be "fined" by banks for moving our own money whenever we want want to. That's even worse than a fee and just because most banks do it, doesn't make it right. Peoples Trust doesn't change it, and they seem to be doing fine.

I never heard before today of any bank that was offering free NSF...

Again, exactly my point: Tangerine becoming just like any other bank.

I think that fee depends mostly on MasterCard...

No it doesn't. MasterCard sets a rate, but then forex commissions are charged by issuing institutions at whatever percentage they want to. Nobody was obliging Tang to impose that 1.5% fee, but they did. Again, no different than most banks. And a departure from their fee-free philosophy.

And yet they still want to distinguish themselves from other banks (online or not) by trying to capitalize on its own legacy for being different, innovative and fee free. I'm not saying Tang is not allowed to change, but it's disheartening to see that they are trying to be something that they are no more.

I'd be more ok with these changes if they came out said: look, our business model has changed, and we imposing these new fees, and lowering our interests rates. But when they try to dress it up as "fair" fees and "industry practices" it makes you think "don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining."

Luckily there is still competition: for day to day banking, PC Finacial and Canadian Direct are becoming more and more comparable alternatives.

As for their ATM network, it's far better now than it ever was before Scotiabank took over (including access to foreign ATM). But I never saw that as their weakness.

April 9, 2016
3:19 pm
dentgal
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Hi Loonie: I'm already at the max at tanga ($500K). They offered me:
0.8% of my existing $500K and the 3% on new money above the $500K; OR,
2% and leave the $500 (and i suppose I could add more and still get the 2% on the whole balance)
-had they lowered me to 0.8%, they know that i will take the money out!

i wish PC would do something....
do they no longer offer specials???

April 10, 2016
2:35 am
Loonie
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I agree with Peseta. The changes have been gradual and sometimes subtle, but the direction is clear. As always, the mandate of a bank is to give us as little as possible while still getting our business because it is not beholden to its customers or to the public good. I must say, I have never seen such a blatant example of how this works until Tang got into this cat-and-mouse game with rates.

Generally, however, I have benefitted and have kept money there, so they are doing quite a good job of this technique. However, I hate it. I think we all hate being manipulated and having our time wasted with playing games, and this is what is making people angry. It does NOT inspire loyalty. It only inspires a kind of addiction to or entrapment in playing games, IMHO.

Thanks for the explanation, dentgal. I would have done the same as you probably, but would also be looking around... If PC comes through, then you'll get a better deal from Tang the next time.

I have the 2% deal that I think expires in June. I haven't done it before and have always received the best offer going, but, this time, I don't trust that it will happen again so I think I'll be moving some of it out before then.

April 10, 2016
6:41 am
SavingIsGood
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Peseta said

Miron said

Peseta said
Sad to see an innovative bank slowly become just like any other one with low interest rates, high fees and a lot of lip service.

Meanwhile, there are no fees at all sf-wink

Right :)

RRSP and TFSA transfer outs are now feed at $45!
NSF fee was introduced a few months ago at $25
MasterCard charges a forex fee of 1.5%
A free Whoops protection was substitued by conventional overdraft at 19% APR.

So Tanga is slowly become just like any other bank. They can dress it up as "fair" fees, "lower" fees or "standard industry practice" fees, but the truth of the matter is that the vast majority of their clients are with them because they ran away from fees and those very standard industry practices. Its so unfortunate that they are quickly moving away from what they used to be.

At this rate they might as well get absorbed by Scotiabank so they can save themselves some marketing dollars on two separate brands.

- There was always a fee for moving money form registered accounts. There is work involved in opening registered account. You get reimbursed by receiving bank. No issue.
- You SHOULD be punished if you go over the limit or write fake cheques. Charge should be $500 so you would think twice when you want to do kiting. No issue.
- You Should pay if you borrow money from the bank. No issue.

Tang is owned by Scotia. Scotia is A BANK, not your on-line shop nor 'innovative' bank. You should be happy you are not paying fee for chequing/saving account, having unlimited transactions and not forcing you to have 3 banking 'products' nor maintaining certain balance to avoid few bucks fee.
Just count days before Tang cancels all above and you start paying for privilege having account with them, $25 for 50 cheques and 1 free withdrawal.

There is NO free lunch unless you can run fast and have a getaway car with fake license plates.
ING was innovative and had high interest rates before everybody; ICICI had crazy high interest rates; They are all leveled out now. I do not keep a cent at Tang unless they offer better rate than everybody else. Why should I?

April 10, 2016
7:32 am
monju00
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Tangerine offered me 3% rate; however, I am not going to move my money. EQ is offering 3% regular rate. There is no point of moving my money to tangerine. I am done with their cat-and-mouse game until EQ drops their rate!

April 10, 2016
7:40 am
2of3aintbad
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SavingIsGood, there was not always a transfer fee. The $45 transfer fee for registered accounts was introduced by Tangerine starting Jan 2015. Whether it is reasonable is a different issue.

April 10, 2016
8:39 am
Miron
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SavingIsGood said

Tang is owned by Scotia. Scotia is A BANK, not your on-line shop nor 'innovative' bank. You should be happy you are not paying fee for chequing/saving account, having unlimited transactions and not forcing you to have 3 banking 'products' nor maintaining certain balance to avoid few bucks fee.
Just count days before Tang cancels all above and you start paying for privilege having account with them, $25 for 50 cheques and 1 free withdrawal.

There is NO free lunch unless you can run fast and have a getaway car with fake license plates.
ING was innovative and had high interest rates before everybody; ICICI had crazy high interest rates; They are all leveled out now. I do not keep a cent at Tang unless they offer better rate than everybody else. Why should I?

SavingIsGood, I could not say it better... but you know, whenever you get used to some items for free, it is very upsetting to be taken back! But as we know, nothing last for ever!
Scotia Bank is the boss playing the same game as all regular banks... we should be happy that we had those 'gifts' as they lasted... and as I said before: if there is no competition why would be any bank keep giving them?
It is the same thing as complaining about gas prices, no competition, they are all charging the same with a very few exceptions! Just because they can! Who cares about loyalty anymore? sf-confused

April 10, 2016
3:19 pm
SavingIsGood
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All these 'freebies' are just a smart advertising way. Same as local heroin dealer's offer of a hit for $5. You get hooked and then it is difficult to quit. How many poor souls keep their hard earned money (not to worry, lottery winner do not open saving accounts; they burn money within few months and then are poorer than before...) earning 0.8% interest because they 'trust' and they are 'used' to such a great bank - ING. What? New name is Tangerine? You are kidding me? Why not Potato? Or Broccoli? Cucumber...
Very few people 'shop around' for better rate; I hear this every day: Why should I check other banks? They all offer the same rate anyway...

Competition? What is that? Some 10 or more years ago, it was fun driving around on Friday night by few gas station checking which one has lowest price. Saturday used to be gas increase price day... Today? Check web site; hope reported price is real and not somebody's mean joke; drive there if saving is greater than wasted gas; buy gas; take few paper napkins as freebie; dip a small jug to get some free windshield washer... Boring. Today even air is charged... Cheap dipsticks...

April 10, 2016
5:14 pm
Peseta
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SavingIsGood said

All these 'freebies' are just a smart advertising way. Same as local heroin dealer's offer of a hit for $5. You get hooked and then it is difficult to quit.

Something is really wrong with the picture when you compare banks to heroin dealers. If that's the category of moral standards that you characterize our banking industry with, perhaps a dialogue should be about more serious issues than low interest rates. Despite my disappointments with our banks' fees and business practices, I respect them way too much to trash them like you did.

People SHOULD be punished by the banks? Because banks are what? The judiciary?! I thought "punishments" could only imposed by the courts? At least in this country.

As far as I know - and correct me if I'm wrong - banks are allowed to lend tenfold of my deposit. On top of that, they charge those borrowers interest rates that dwarf to what's offered to the clients. So if anybody should be grateful for having our deposits it's the banks and not the clients, because it's ultimately our deposits that they generate profits from. The day I have to thank my bank for keeping my money - like its a favour of some sort - is the day I'll say ciao ciao to all of them and keep it in a safe.

As I've said before, any bank is free to charge anything they want as long as it's within the limits of the law. I have no issue with that (although in Canada we get the least bang for our buck when it comes to banking products). But the annoying part is when the bank, in this instance Tangerine, builds a reputation - and our loyalty - for being forward thinking, innovative, anti-fee, customer friendly, different ... then slowly starts becoming just like any other one, and tries to pretend like it's business as usual when clearly it is not.

And may I correct you: it's Tangerine's privilege to have our money, not the other way around. The day they introduce *any* fees or limits to their chequing account is the day I'll be closing it. There will always be someone with fee-free accounts, and that's where I'll be going. If not, I'll happily maintain a minimum balance, which I'm also ok with (considering that the alternative is earning a few cents in interest in a savings account).

With respect to fee-free accounts, I have to say PC Financial has always been true to its original promise and the original product. They are what they say they are and they don't dress up anything for what it's not. Canadian Direct is also a viable alternative, not to mention credit unions who are always happy to welcome your business.

April 10, 2016
7:35 pm
implode
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No such offer in email or my inbox for me :( I'm still on the 2% till mid June.
Considering opening an EQ Bank account, but there's only a reservation available.

April 10, 2016
8:23 pm
James
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I have no offers from Tangerine and I'm not currently on any promotional rate with them. I called to tell them I saw the promotional rate offered on their website (via the search function) and I see they've now taken down the references to it. When I called, they did not offer me any incentive (other than the 0.80% interest rate) to move money to them.

(I'm just mentioning this out of interest as it seems people are trying to figure how the rates are calculated.)

April 11, 2016
6:59 am
Miron
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Peseta said

People SHOULD be punished by the banks? Because banks are what? The judiciary?! I thought "punishments" could only imposed by the courts? At least in this country.

Good luck to sue a bank because they 'punished' you for submitting a fake cheque!
I don't think that ING was giving unlimited NSF activities... or maybe exactly because of their unlimited 'freebies' that we all love, Scotia Bank bought them as they were going down toward bankruptcy!

Peseta said So if anybody should be grateful for having our deposits it's the banks and not the clients, because it's ultimately our deposits that they generate profits from. The day I have to thank my bank for keeping my money - like its a favour of some sort - is the day I'll say ciao ciao to all of them and keep it in a safe.

It seems that you are forgetting something: a bank's job is not just to keep your savings money but also about all your daily banking and we can not live without them as much as they can not live without us! So it is reciprocal! If you don't keep your money there, how would you pay your bills on line... how would you give a cheque? I am not going to use cash only again as I did the first 30 years of my life, so forget about the safe sf-surprised
A lot of people never heard of savings accounts but they still need a bank to keep their money at least for the day when their employer would deposit the salary! What about Credit Cards? What about a line of credit? We need all these products and they take advantage and make a profit from us! Did I mention mortgage?

Peseta said With respect to fee-free accounts, I have to say PC Financial has always been true to its original promise and the original product. They are what they say they are and they don't dress up anything for what it's not.

I am working with PC Financial since 2002 and it is not exactly true! Along the years they also got worse, not to mention the raising of the existing fees. For instance, if you are using the overdraft, on top of the classic 19% interest charge they are charging also a fine: $4.97 unless you can go above zero balance in the same day! This fine was not there about 5 years ago.

Once, whenever they had a 'sale' (higher than regular interest) I was getting emails and notices while logging in. Not anymore... I discover them on this forum! It is true that they are applicable to ALL their clients unlike Tangerine...

I could once program the moving of money from savings to checking in the same day as the payment of a bill was also programmed. Not anymore because for a 'smart' reason, they changed the order of operations and they are first paying the bill and AFTER 1 hour they are moving the money in. As a result, you are 1 hour on overdraft so they can charge the 19% interest! Smart, right?

I don't think they have any free NSF policy but it happened to me once only and they cancelled the fee with the promise that it would not happen again sf-embarassed

April 11, 2016
10:12 am
MiMi
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I rec'd two separate emails about the current bonus rates. An offer of 3% on a joint account that is less than 3 years old and an offer of 1.5% on an account that is 17 years old! I emailed "Client Services" to ask about the discrepency and was told : "Because these are based on the Client's Savings history with us, offers can vary. As a result, we can't comment on how other people bank with us or why they might have been given a better rate." The Client rep obviously failed to understand that I was asking about two accounts I hold, two accounts within the same family, not "other people" whose history cannot be commented upon for privacy reasons!
The Client Service rep ended his reply with "thanks to Clients like you that we’ve been able to create better and better Client experiences." arghhh!
I replied to bluntly tell him that his reply was completely unsatisfactory.
This has really got me ticked off. I've been naive enough to think that everyone with identical types of accounts gets the same bonus offers but after this recent experience and my discovery of this very informative forum, I have a very different picture. I always knew you had to shop for mortgage rates, but never imagined that identical savings accounts could be offered different rates. I told the Client rep that I will be looking elsewhere for savings accounts and posting my dissatisfaction to social media. I was wary when BNS took over from ING as BNS has given my Mom very poor service (and she's been a client of theirs since the 1940s!)

April 11, 2016
1:06 pm
3oakwest
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As I mentioned in an earlier reply, I wasn't even given an offer of any kind.

Someone else mentioned that they called in three or four times and got an offer. I tried that and they still told me I would not be getting anything. I ask for a Supervisor and was told that even they could not offer me anything.

BNS is better than Tangerine at time time!!

April 11, 2016
10:30 pm
Loonie
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MiMi- it depends on who is the "primary' account holder in a joint account. Tangerine will consider the joint account as part of your client profile only if you are the "primary" account holder; otherwise, it will go on the profile of the other person. I don't know if this applies to you, but that's how they think.

April 12, 2016
12:47 am
Peseta
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Miron said

Good luck to sue a bank because they 'punished' you for submitting a fake cheque!
I don't think that ING was giving unlimited NSF activities... or maybe exactly because of their unlimited 'freebies' that we all love, Scotia Bank bought them as they were going down toward bankruptcy!

I never said anybody wanted to sue a bank, nor did I suggest that writing "fake" cheques should be tolerated. Quite the contrary: I said that banks were free to charge whatever fee they wanted to change, and that wasn't my issue. Also, there is a big difference between an NSF cheque and a fake cheque, the latter being an offense. Please read messages before responding and check your facts to give your posts credibility: you're entitled to your opinions, but just because you think that ING wasn't giving out free NSF's doesn't make it factual truth. The truth is that Tangerine didn't have NSF fees until June of last year. And NSF can be a result of a million different reasons. Why do you assume that it's always a bad cheque that was willfully written? It could be an IT error, a direct debit snafu, or a simple human error.

It seems that you are forgetting something: a bank's job is not just to keep your savings money but also about all your daily banking and we can not live without them as much as they can not live without us! So it is reciprocal! If you don't keep your money there, how would you pay your bills on line... how would you give a cheque? I am not going to use cash only again as I did the first 30 years of my life, so forget about the safe sf-surprised
A lot of people never heard of savings accounts but they still need a bank to keep their money at least for the day when their employer would deposit the salary! What about Credit Cards? What about a line of credit? We need all these products and they take advantage and make a profit from us! Did I mention mortgage?

Again, my issue is not what bank does or what bank charges for its services, so re-read my message. My issue is that the old message Tangerine wants to keep sending to clients (about being better and different) vastly differs from their actions, and at the end of the day actions speak louder than words.

I dont need any particular bank, just like I don't need any particular commercial business. As a customer I have a choice to give my business to anyone I want to, and banking is no different. Just like in any industry, businesses need customers, not the other way around. So, yes, Tanga should be thanking me and not the other way around. There are way too many banks and credit unions in this country for financial institutions to take us for granted. If I have to pay fees, it might as well be to a bank that treats me equally as all the other clients.

With respect to managing life using only cash, I agree with you that all the things you mentioned in your message do make life easier. But I disagree that credit cards, savings accounts, mortgages, etc. are indispensable. You *could* live using cash only albeit, as I said, it would be challenging. But if it came down to having to thank banks to keep my money or using cash, I'd go with the letter than the first.

I am working with PC Financial since 2002 and it is not exactly true! Along the years they also got worse, not to mention the raising of the existing fees. For instance, if you are using the overdraft, on top of the classic 19% interest charge they are charging also a fine: $4.97 unless you can go above zero balance in the same day! This fine was not there about 5 years ago.

Once, whenever they had a 'sale' (higher than regular interest) I was getting emails and notices while logging in. Not anymore... I discover them on this forum! It is true that they are applicable to ALL their clients unlike Tangerine...

I didn't say that PC FINANCIAL was perfect. But as you point out, they apply their promotions to all of their customers equally, and they don't dress up their policies for what they aren't. That's my whole point, which I don't understand why you fail to see.

April 12, 2016
6:34 pm
SavingIsGood
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Bottom line is: Tang awkward offer, not publicly promoted, discriminatory applied by who-knows-what criteria is BAD business move.
I kept more than 200K in Tang account during previous promotion. That is 100K completely uninsured and it will be my loss if they go belly up. So I trusted them (for a price, of course: I trust you, you PAY me) and their computers could figure out that I will be back if proper interest is offered. I must be blind but I do not see a point of 3 months high interest offer for 'new' money. Any monkey with ant's brain can figure out that 99.99% taking advantage of promotion high interest will pull their money after promotion ends to whoever offers the best rate.
Why NOT keep such high valued customers with slightly better interest than the rest banks?

So, after promotion 100M will go back to Manitoba or wherever; offering 1.75% (assuming everybody else offers 1.70%) most of the 100M will stay in Tang books. Because we are all greedy admit it or not and 0.05% more is a BIG deal for some. Next promotion will NOT bring another 100M as all money is already at Tang. So Tang will keep paying 1.75% AND KEEP all the money AND will NOT pay 2.5-3% they are paying now...

And Mr. Peseta (which is worth $CAD 0.01 if you manege to exchange it still), you are missing a point. Comparing banks (you must be employed by one of big 5 as you love them so much) with drug dealer is to make a point that company attracts you with too good to be true banking conditions (free cheques, no NFS charge, unlimited transactions, etc.) AND when you get hooked and organize your life around them, THEN you get surprise.
And yes - anybody should be 'punished' for going over the limit, kiting cheques, etc. You do not like banking system? Keep your money in shoe box. Or put sign on your lawn: I have a lot of money at home and no means to protect myself as I am not allowed to keep loaded gun handy. Please ring the bell, do not break my door, I will serve you with the smile...

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