Ontario Hydro | General financial discussion | Discussion forum

Please consider registering
guest

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —




— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

No permission to create posts
sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_TopicIcon
Ontario Hydro
October 11, 2020
8:40 pm
Bud
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 1154
Member Since:
February 20, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Tiered pricing for example if u use 700kWh a month on average is it still the better choice. Is over 600 really expensive..

Tiered:
"Customers are generally allowed up to 1,000 kWh per month in the winter and up to 600 kWh per month in the summer before the higher price kicks in, although those thresholds can change"

https://torontosun.com/news/provincial/power-to-the-people-ontario-hydro-customers-have-choice-to-make

What does the fridge and computer left on cost

October 12, 2020
9:21 am
pooreva
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 139
Member Since:
April 2, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

It all depends on prices for tiered vs. TOU prices.

I am wondering if anybody of this board uses more than 1000kW/month in winter time? Unless you are in rural area where there is no gas line and you have to use electricity to heat your dwelling how could you use 1000kW/month? I can understand if you have to run medical equipment 24/7, though...
Modern TVs use very little electricity so you can get your ad/propaganda fix 24/7, no problem. On the other hand, I can see houses having all possible lights on (including externals) all night. But then again, most light are LED so HOW can somebody use 1000kW/month?

October 12, 2020
9:30 am
savemoresaveoften
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 363
Member Since:
March 30, 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

pooreva said
It all depends on prices for tiered vs. TOU prices.

I am wondering if anybody of this board uses more than 1000kW/month in winter time? Unless you are in rural area where there is no gas line and you have to use electricity to heat your dwelling how could you use 1000kW/month? I can understand if you have to run medical equipment 24/7, though...
Modern TVs use very little electricity so you can get your ad/propaganda fix 24/7, no problem. On the other hand, I can see houses having all possible lights on (including externals) all night. But then again, most light are LED so HOW can somebody use 1000kW/month?  

Someone with some high end class A monoblock amplifier and blast it 24/7 ? 🙂

I have to read the 600kW vs 1000kW twice to make sure I understand 1000kW is indeed for winter (My hydro bill is 3 times the amount in summer vs winter)...

But yeah without seeing the actual tiered rate, not possible to even guesstimate which pricing is better...

October 12, 2020
10:37 am
Norman1
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 3462
Member Since:
April 6, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

It is possible to reach 1,000 kWh each month because things do add up.

A desktop computer uses 100W to 200 W. That's 0.1 - 0.2 kW.

The 24" monitor may use 50 W = 0.05 kW.

Total is 0.15 kW to 0.25 kW.

On 24 hours a day means from 0.15 kW x 24 h = 3.6 kWh to 0.25 kW x 24 = 6 kWh per day.

For a 30 day month, multiply by 30 and one has 108 kWh to 180 kWh of the 1,000 kWh already!

October 12, 2020
10:51 am
BillieBob
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 55
Member Since:
November 6, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

But yeah without seeing the actual tiered rate, not possible to even guesstimate which pricing is better... 

My guess is that the Tiered pricing will be the Mid-Peak rate for the first 600 kWH in summer or 1000 kWh in winter and then the On-Peak rate for usage over those amounts.

Info from the OEB's website:

Bill Calculator
There is no guarantee you will save money if you switch from TOU to Tiered prices. The total bill impact of switching will vary depending on how much electricity is consumed in a month and when it is consumed during the day.

Check back later this month, when we will post a bill calculator that will allow you to see side-by-side what your total bill would look like under both TOU and Tiered prices, taking into account the other rates charged by your electricity utility."

https://www.oeb.ca/rates-and-your-bill/electricity-rates/choosing-your-electricity-price-plan

October 12, 2020
1:17 pm
Alexandre
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 237
Member Since:
November 8, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

My household used more than 600 kWh this July.

60% of my household electricity consumption is at off-peak time, so my guess would be TOU will result in smaller electricity bill for me, comparing with Tiered pricing.

Still, will see what prices are for TOU and Tiered, then it'll be a simple math to figure which one is better for me.

PS. If I had a BEV in my household, I'll surely go over 1,000 kWh in any given month. Of course, in that case, TOU would benefit me a lot.

October 13, 2020
10:02 am
Bill
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2022
Member Since:
September 11, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
October 13, 2020
11:06 am
BillieBob
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 55
Member Since:
November 6, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

The Bill Calculator is now available on the OEB's website. I did a comparison using the data from my most expensive TOU bill last winter (806 kWh - period from Dec 7 to Jan 11 - $132.85). Tiered Pricing will be the more economical choice for me based on this.

Screen-Shot-2020-10-13-at-1.48.42-PM.png

https://www.oeb.ca/rates-and-your-bill/bill-calculator

October 13, 2020
1:35 pm
Alexandre
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 237
Member Since:
November 8, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Alexandre said

60% of my household electricity consumption is at off-peak time, so my guess would be TOU will result in smaller electricity bill for me, comparing with Tiered pricing.

Ran new online calculator, and surprise: TOU is more expensive for me!

I will save $3.66 in the Winter and $1.37 in the Summer, monthly, after fees and taxes.
Savings are not that large, so I'll stay with TOU, why bother switching.

I wonder if Utilities think same way: what is the point of all of this? Why not just TOU for everyone, cuts on administrative costs of managing different billing clients.
Must be one of those Ontario government good intentions.

October 13, 2020
1:38 pm
Kidd
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 571
Member Since:
February 27, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Billie Bob, first off i must say... i love your ex Angelina Jolie.

On your tiered calculations you (they) are using the winter max of 1,000kw with a usage of 806kw. During the summer, the max is only 600kw. The overage price is 14.6 cents per kw.

October 13, 2020
6:33 pm
BillieBob
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 55
Member Since:
November 6, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Kidd said
On your tiered calculations you (they) are using the winter max of 1,000kw with a usage of 806kw. During the summer, the max is only 600kw. The overage price is 14.6 cents per kw.  

I hadn't thought about doing the summer calculation so thanks for the reminder. My highest consumption bill during this past summer was 840 kWh for the period from Jun 11 to Jul 11.

Tiered Pricing works out to be the more economical plan for me year-round.

The OEB also provides an annual calculator. The yearly savings for me on the Tiered Plan vs TOU, using the data from my last 12 bills, would be just under $54.00.

Screen-Shot-2020-10-13-at-9.20.46-PM.png

October 14, 2020
7:42 am
savemoresaveoften
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 363
Member Since:
March 30, 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

have seen a few simulation here and seems like at most talking about $5 a month give or take ?
How much Hydro company has pissed away to set this up ? The money prob better spend just revert back to TOU and pays it out as a rebate.

October 14, 2020
10:38 am
Bill
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 2022
Member Since:
September 11, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Agreed, probably just a few bucks difference per month, and because of seasonal variances you'd have to do a 12-month comparison of usage in each of the 3 price categories to see what's best on an annual basis (though I suppose you can opt in and out if different seasons cause a big difference for you, e.g. some people have cottages and may be there for many months of a year - obviously have to do separate calculations for separate properties), so probably way too much effort for minimal gain. Also your last 12 month history may not be representative of the future as (due to the China virus) many folks have been at home during the day a lot more than going forward. In general, during peak time working folks are out of the house more than retired ones so the former might be more likely to benefit from TOU pricing.

The OEB site says "Historically, the typical residential customer who paid TOU prices has used nearly two thirds of their power at off-peak times – the time when the lowest TOU price applies. The other third of their power use was typically split equally between on- and mid-peak times", so if you think you're "typical" you can just use those ratios for purposes of the online calculator.

October 14, 2020
11:07 am
JenE
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 301
Member Since:
May 24, 2016
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

For me, the tiered rate is probably preferable in the winter simply because I can do laundry, use dishwasher, other appliances whenever it is convenient for me, rather than waiting until after 7 pm or week-ends. Summer is very different. A quick look at my hydro usage May-September shows around 1000 kWh each month (and I’m very careful!), so TOU is probably the way to go during those months. From what I’ve read one is able to move from one method to another, so perhaps that’s what I’ll do after I’ve done a deeper analysis.

October 14, 2020
11:51 am
savemoresaveoften
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 363
Member Since:
March 30, 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Just run a few scenarios, this is basically the math:

Even if 2/3 of your usage is off-peak, then the tiered pricing will provide some savings. I am surprised to see that but this is according to the calculator on the site. This is due to the extra "delivery charge" under TOU, which is already embedded in the Tiered pricing. Look at the detail on that screen and you will see what I mean.
The above statement is only untrue if u are a big power user (>> 1200 monthly).
For my household, we are about 600-700 in the winter, peak summer months about 1200-1300 (my wife likes to blast the aircon to feel like the arctic).
So unless you have electric baseboard heating and electric water heater, chances are tiered pricing will be a net saver for you, with the added benefit of not adjustment your power usage to line up with TOU pricing as well.

October 14, 2020
1:28 pm
pooreva
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 139
Member Since:
April 2, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I am very low in electricity usage... You will be laughing if I tell you my numbers.
Nevertheless, when I use OEB Detailed Calculator and plug in few winter and few summer months Tiered pricing is always better for a less than a buck/month.
Still considering it as it will provide some minuscule saving and avoid living by the clock.

October 14, 2020
2:21 pm
Alexandre
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 237
Member Since:
November 8, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

There should be an incentive to use TOU and switch load to off peak time. If customer uses 2/3 of their power at off peak time and still does not see substantial difference between TOU and Tiered - that's wrong.

It tells me off peak TOU price is set too high, or Tiered too low.

October 14, 2020
5:00 pm
BillieBob
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 55
Member Since:
November 6, 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Alexandre said
Savings are not that large, so I'll stay with TOU, why bother switching. 

Even if my savings are only $50 a year, I will elect to go with Tiered Pricing. I'd rather keep my money than give it to HydroOne. According to their website, they have 1.4 million mostly rural customers. Hmmm - $50 x 1.4 million…

October 14, 2020
5:34 pm
Loonie
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 6446
Member Since:
October 21, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

We just calculated that the annual savings for choosing Tiered would be... $7.58 !

WOW!!! Is that what all the fuss was about? sf-confused

We have gas heat, gas clothes dryer, and gas water heater.
We have never exceeded 1000Kwh/month.

I expect our electricity usage to go down next summer because we just finally got rid of that cursed thermostat that automatically re-sets every so many hours. We've gone back to a DIY thermostat, where, when you tell it what to do, it sticks with it until you tell it to do something else. Ah the joy of the simple pleasure of a thermostat that doesn't have a mind of its own!

October 15, 2020
6:09 am
savemoresaveoften
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 363
Member Since:
March 30, 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Alexandre said
There should be an incentive to use TOU and switch load to off peak time. If customer uses 2/3 of their power at off peak time and still does not see substantial difference between TOU and Tiered - that's wrong.

It tells me off peak TOU price is set too high, or Tiered too low.  

yes I am quite disappointed but not surprised they fail to implement what a sensible person would do. Called it a choice and its more political then anything else.
Most WILL think TOU provides savings if one is willing to shift their usage, the math shows otherwise..

No permission to create posts

Please write your comments in the forum.