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Tangerine Bank has NO maturity options for a maturing TFSA GIC
March 18, 2021
2:46 pm
TommyT
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The only option for changing the maturity is to a savings account. The option for where the interest goes actually has two options and lists both savings accounts. The principle amount only lists "savings account" and gives no option which savings account to choose. The problem is I have two savings accounts. One is a savings account and the other one is a TFSA savings account. Tangerine gives no option which one to choose. I can't seem to get them on the phone. I already have $75,500 in TFSA's and the last thing I need is for this maturing TFSA GIC to go into my daily interest savings account and having to wait for more than two years to make up the amount. It's about 13,000 dollars. Their web site is permanently busted and these are the only options. Note I'm trying to transfer the 13 grand to a brokerage house from the TFSA daily interest but who knows which savings account it will end up in? Tangerine only lists "savings account" for the principle.

March 18, 2021
3:26 pm
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TommyT said
The only option for changing the maturity is to a savings account. The option for where the interest goes actually has two options and lists both savings accounts. The principle amount only lists "savings account" and gives no option which savings account to choose. The problem is I have two savings accounts. One is a savings account and the other one is a TFSA savings account. Tangerine gives no option which one to choose. I can't seem to get them on the phone. I already have $75,500 in TFSA's and the last thing I need is for this maturing TFSA GIC to go into my daily interest savings account and having to wait for more than two years to make up the amount. It's about 13,000 dollars. Their web site is permanently busted and these are the only options. Note I'm trying to transfer the 13 grand to a brokerage house from the TFSA daily interest but who knows which savings account it will end up in? Tangerine only lists "savings account" for the principle.  

If you are in a bind,close your regular saving account,& leave only your TFSA active.Money will have to go into it.Once it is in there,reopen another regular savings account.

March 18, 2021
3:46 pm
topgun
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When a TFSA GIC at Tangerine matured this January the principle and interest were deposited in my TFSA savings account. I moved the money out on the maturity date. You can setup a transfer on maturity date since Tangerine tells you the maturity value for the GIC.

Have a Great Day

March 19, 2021
4:31 am
Alexandre
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I have Tangerine TFSA GIC maturing this month, I don't have the problems OP described.

When I select "Maturity Options" under TFSA GIC account, I am presented with two options: "Reinvest in a GIC with the same term" and "Pay out GIC to a selected Account."

Choosing "Pay out GIC to a selected account" opens next window with only "TFSA Savings Account" presented to choose from. It clearly states there it is TFSA Savings account, gives last four digits of account number and amount of funds currently held in TFSA Savings account.

It would be really hard to confuse it with regular savings account.

March 19, 2021
9:07 am
Vatox
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Alexandre said
I have Tangerine TFSA GIC maturing this month, I don't have the problems OP described.

When I select "Maturity Options" under TFSA GIC account, I am presented with two options: "Reinvest in a GIC with the same term" and "Pay out GIC to a selected Account."

Choosing "Pay out GIC to a selected account" opens next window with only "TFSA Savings Account" presented to choose from. It clearly states there it is TFSA Savings account, gives last four digits of account number and amount of funds currently held in TFSA Savings account.

It would be really hard to confuse it with regular savings account.  

Yes. I don’t quite see OP’s problem. I have always had the option to payout to the savings account and the number of the account is shown, so you can be sure it’s going to the TFSA savings.
Of course, it’s been several months now since I had any GICs there, so perhaps something is screwy.

March 22, 2021
5:51 am
TommyT
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By some miracle Tangerine got it right as the money transferred to the correct account today. That's the end of my banking with Tangerine as the money is being transferred out of the TFSA daily interest. All other accounts with them I'm closing. I was with them ages ago back when they were ING Direct. They still list all the interest accumulated over the decades at Tangerine as far back as when they were ING Direct.

March 22, 2021
9:00 am
topgun
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Once they paid hundreds of dollars a year. Now it is a pittance.

Have a Great Day

March 22, 2021
2:16 pm
Vatox
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topgun said
Once they paid hundreds of dollars a year. Now it is a pittance.  

It’s too bad that everyone in Canada doesn’t think like we do. I know quite a few people that still hold all of their cash savings at Tang, they can’t be bothered to open accounts elsewhere. So we are the minority and Tang doesn’t worry that our money has left.

March 23, 2021
9:03 pm
Loonie
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It may be too bad for the people with leaden feet and fingers, but it's better for us if they stay put. If they all moved to CTB or EQ etc., the rates there would drop too due to excessive deposits.

I no longer waste my breath trying to convince people to switch. Those who are interested will find out what is available. Most people will stay put, and most of them are at the Big Banks, of which Tang is now decidedly a part.

March 24, 2021
9:20 am
Vatox
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Loonie said
It may be too bad for the people with leaden feet and fingers, but it's better for us if they stay put. If they all moved to CTB or EQ etc., the rates there would drop too due to excessive deposits.

I no longer waste my breath trying to convince people to switch. Those who are interested will find out what is available. Most people will stay put, and most of them are at the Big Banks, of which Tang is now decidedly a part.  

Yes, I would have to agree with you. I was thinking along the lines of competition, but the Big Banks seem to be somewhat immune to that. I guess I should be saying it’s too bad that Big Banks are allowed to buy up the online banks like ING and Ally.

March 24, 2021
5:19 pm
Loonie
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I'd support you on the latter, but we have not a snowball's chance in Hades - as you know!

It would be interesting to know what percentage of old ING customers Tang has actually retained at this point. Most of us, in the early days of ING at least, were "early adopters" of alternatives, of which there are more now. I would guess that most of us have now pretty much exhausted any largesse from Tang and have little to no money there currently or are just waiting for a GIC to mature.

March 25, 2021
1:18 am
Rick
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There was a time when I had RSPs, TFSAs, HISA (with something in it), for both my wife and me, USD HISA, GIC's, Line of credit, Chequing account, two mortgages, and credit card. As the fees went up and their rates came down, I cashed them in and/or closed them out. Now we have the credit card for the 2% stuff, USD account with a couple hundred bux in it, and empty chequing and savings accounts waiting for a promo, which has not arrived since my last one expired on Feb 28. They retained me, but not with much. They have nowhere near the service or rates ING provided. Wouldn't take a lot to cash in my chips with them for good. And I'm positive they wouldn't care.

March 25, 2021
6:44 pm
Norman1
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It is hard for its parent, the Bank of Nova Scotia, to care much about Tangerine deposits when the parent has around $762 billion of deposits of its own.

In contrast, Tangerine Bank has around $44 billion or about 6% of the parent's.

March 25, 2021
6:45 pm
RetirEd
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Ally was not an "online bank." They had full service except for branches, answered mail quickly and boasted great telephone access - not 24/7, but I NEVER had to wait on hold and they were always understanding, intelligent and generous. And they allowed monthly-compounded GICs with monthly interest payout, so I could keep the full $100K in at 4% and never be over the CDIC limit by more than one month's interest.

Come to think of it, did Ally ever have on-line services? Anyone here remember using them? When they were sold, I had to deal with the schmucks at RBC who took over my deposits. RBC fought hard to try to impose fees and made it very hard to get my money out intact when the GICs matured. I miss Ally!
RetirEd

March 26, 2021
1:41 am
Loonie
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ING opened in 1997 with zero deposits. According to Reuters, 12 years later, when Scotia bought it during the Great Recession, it had $30 billion in deposits. Now, 10-12 years later I am told deposits stand at $44 billion - and they are paying peanuts for the privilege to most customers.
I have no doubt that Scotia cares about this, just as they would care if their own deposits shrank by 6%.

Setting aside those who are able to get promotional rates (I'm sure the minority) and those who have decent outstanding GICs, and considering the steadily declining service quality and introduction of fees, it remains a mystery to me why anyone would put their money in Tang - especially those of us who were with ING, as we are proven early adopters, and we will be early exiters too if it's not worth our while.

Reuters said ING had 1.8 million depositors in 2009, which works out to an average deposit of about $22,000. Even if I assume that the average deposit has now grown to $40,000, the difference in interest annually between Tang and the Big Banks is only in the neighbourhood of $20. I don't think very many people would be willing to sign up for so little. And I don't think many existing customers would stay if they know they can get $500-$700 somewhere else.

Tang is skating on thin ice if they expect to hang on to deposits this way. And, yeah, I think Scotia does care if profits are at stake. Every division is supposed to earn money, the more the better. Perhaps they intend to make it up in credit cards?

Perhaps a better question would be, does AltaRed care? If I remember correctly, he has in the past, as a shareholder, expressed dismay at some of Tang's antics.

March 26, 2021
8:07 am
topgun
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Loonie said
ING opened in 1997 with zero deposits. According to Reuters, 12 years later, when Scotia bought it during the Great Recession, it had $30 billion in deposits. Now, 10-12 years later I am told deposits stand at $44 billion - and they are paying peanuts for the privilege to most customers.
I have no doubt that Scotia cares about this, just as they would care if their own deposits shrank by 6%.

Setting aside those who are able to get promotional rates (I'm sure the minority) and those who have decent outstanding GICs, and considering the steadily declining service quality and introduction of fees, it remains a mystery to me why anyone would put their money in Tang - especially those of us who were with ING, as we are proven early adopters, and we will be early exiters too if it's not worth our while.

Reuters said ING had 1.8 million depositors in 2009, which works out to an average deposit of about $22,000. Even if I assume that the average deposit has now grown to $40,000, the difference in interest annually between Tang and the Big Banks is only in the neighbourhood of $20. I don't think very many people would be willing to sign up for so little. And I don't think many existing customers would stay if they know they can get $500-$700 somewhere else.

Tang is skating on thin ice if they expect to hang on to deposits this way. And, yeah, I think Scotia does care if profits are at stake. Every division is supposed to earn money, the more the better. Perhaps they intend to make it up in credit cards?
  

Thanks for the historical numbers. The number of depositors has dropped from 1.8 million in 2009 to 500,000 depositors in 2020 or so. For some reason the average balances have grown 3.2%-3.9% annually. I move my money to greener pastures when funds are unlocked. The short term promotions of 3-4 months are not worth the bother for most people.

Have a Great Day

March 26, 2021
9:53 am
Alexandra
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Ally used to be on the comparison charts here. I banked on-line with them. I had a TFSA with them under "Resmor" . When RBC took them over, all deposits went to them if you didn't request otherwise. The original TFSA with Ally/Resmor was at a pretty good rate. Not so much with RBC but they did honour all Ally GIC rates until maturity. Google Ally/Resmor and you will see the discussions on here about it.

March 26, 2021
2:35 pm
Vatox
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Yeah! Ally had the best commercials too!

March 26, 2021
3:38 pm
Loonie
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Adding in topgun's customer figures, that means Tang deposits now average about $88,000 but they have lost over 2/3 of their customers.
Although we don't know how many of them were former ING clients, as some new ones will have been added, it seems fair to assume a substantial proportion of those who have left were from ING, probably most.
To me, this suggests that those remaining are either not paying a lot of attention, haven't yet bothered to look at alternatives, or are in mutual funds.
To my mind, this does not foretell a rosy future for Tang. Eventually, most of the sleepers will wake up and move on or die off, because there will be no reason to stay. Many of those who stay will top out at a deposit of 100K for insurance reasons, so they have very limited growth potential. If the people in mutual funds are successful at that, they will eventually have enough invested that it makes better sense for them to go elsewhere. Perhaps Tang is doing better with its credit card business? I don't know anything about their loan side.

Ultimately, a bank needs more customers in order to grow and thrive. If I were Scotia, I'd be wondering how I could unload this dog, and, if it came to it, I would not prop it up. But, for now, they may just be riding out the current economic malaise.
Maybe they really did buy it with the idea of closing it down, although seem unlikely as it has dragged on for so many years. RBC's intention was clearly to squash Ally.
It would be interesting to revisit these figures in a year to see if the customer bleed continues.

March 26, 2021
9:09 pm
Norman1
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Tangerine Bank has not been bleeding customers. Their press release a few weeks ago says they have over two million clients:

About Tangerine Bank

Tangerine Bank is a digital bank that delivers simplified everyday banking to Canadians. With over 2 million Clients and close to $40 billion in total assets, it’s one of Canada’s leading digital banks. …

Clients and deposits are means to an end and not an end in themselves. The end is profit, not number of clients or amount of deposits. RBC's purchase of Ally Canada is a good example of that.

For RBC, the desirable and very profitable part of Ally Canada was its book of car leases. RBC can borrow at provincial bond rates and does not need to pay the junk bond rates that Ally Canada was paying on its deposits. Consequently, Ally Canada's book of deposit liabilities was just a cost to get that book of car leases. The earlier RBC could legally wind up those Ally deposits, the less those deposits would cost RBC above what it needs to pay on RBC deposits.

Earlier comments I quoted from former Tangerine Bank CEO Peter Aceto reflect the perspective of catering to suitable clients instead of catering to as many clients as possible.

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