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A survey on TFSA direct transfer cost
December 31, 2022
8:38 am
hwyc
GTA
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Hello, is it a good time to begin a survey on TFSA direct transfer cost ? Has it been done already?

FT to FI Direct Transfer Out In
EQ free free
Oaken free free
Peoples Trust free free
Tangerine $50 free
( typical ) $50 free
TD Direct Investing $150 ?
Manulife ? ?


- '?' - information not found on their website yet
- Partial transfer or full transfer to be differentiated if it matters
- Total transfer cost = transfer-out cost + transfer-in cost
- Transfer process always initiated at the transfer-in side
- data point thread - please do not post individual opinions/discussions, or go off topic
- Click PM to send row addition suggestion, correction (if you approve me as a maintainer) I tend to discourage in-line back & forth postings sf-confused

December 31, 2022
8:54 am
Doug
British Columbia, Canada
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hwyc said
Hello, is it a good time to begin a survey on TFSA direct transfer cost ? Has it been done already?

FT to FI Direct Transfer Out In
EQ free free
Oaken free free
Tangerine $50 free
TD Direct Investing $150 ?
Manulife ? ?


- Total transfer cost = transfer-out cost + transfer-in cost
- Transfer process (T2033) always initiated at the transfer-in side
- Click PM to send row addition suggestion, correction (if you approve me as a maintainer) I tend to discourage in-line back & forth postings sf-confused
  

Assume most will be free to transfer in, and most will have a fee to transfer out (as described below). I've not heard of an FI charging to transfer in. Oaken, and I thought maybe Hubert too, have been the exceptions in not charging to transfer out. Did not know EQ Bank is free to transfer out, and Peoples Trust might also be free to transfer out. All the rest, as I say, will be about $50 to transfer out.

Brokerages charge between $125-150.

Banks and credit unions will generally not reimburse charged transfer out fees, but brokerages will, if transferring between $15-25,000 or more with each transfer.

Cheers,
Doug

January 1, 2023
6:57 pm
Loonie
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Hubert has been free in the past but I think Accelerate has a fee approx $50. It will be interesting to see how that situation develops.

You should assume that whatever fee is cited when you buy will have increased by the time you transfer out (especially if a longer term) and there will be nothing you can do about it except hope for reimbursement elsewhere.

January 5, 2023
8:49 am
hwyc
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FT to FI Direct Transfer Out In Notes
EQ free free
Oaken free free
Peoples Trust free free
Hubert free free
Manulife Bank free free from direct inquiry
Tangerine $50 free
( typical ) $50 free
TD Direct Investing $150 ?


- '?' - information not found on their website yet
- Partial transfer or full transfer to be differentiated if it matters
- Total transfer cost = transfer-out cost + transfer-in cost
- FI to FI direct transfer process always initiated at the transfer-in side

Survey thread - please do not post individual opinions/discussions, or go off topic. Click PM to send suggestion, correction

January 6, 2023
1:30 pm
Loonie
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typically "plus HST"

January 6, 2023
1:37 pm
TommyT
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Doug said

Assume most will be free to transfer in, and most will have a fee to transfer out (as described below). I've not heard of an FI charging to transfer in. Oaken, and I thought maybe Hubert too, have been the exceptions in not charging to transfer out. Did not know EQ Bank is free to transfer out, and Peoples Trust might also be free to transfer out. All the rest, as I say, will be about $50 to transfer out.

Brokerages charge between $125-150.

Banks and credit unions will generally not reimburse charged transfer out fees, but brokerages will, if transferring between $15-25,000 or more with each transfer.

Cheers,
Doug  

If the takeover of Oaken goes through the fees could change in a hurry.

January 6, 2023
2:39 pm
AltaRed
BC Interior
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I concur there is no need to have a column on transfer-in fees. FIs may have minimum thresholds to avoid monthly account minimum fees but I have never heard of a transfer-in fee. Reimbursement of transfer out fees from a sending institution might theoretically be considered a negative transfer-in fee but the specific conditions are so complex and variable, there is no way to put that info in a column.

Speaking about discount brokerages as a group, every big bank discount brokerage I have had direct or anecdotal experience with does not charge for transfer-ins. In most cases as a receiving institution, they will cover some, or all, of the transfer out charges from a sending institution up to perhaps $150 with the amount depending on asset values being transferred. It is usually booked as a 'negative' account administrative charge to avoid any implications of the reimbursement being considered taxable income, or in the case of a registered account, a contribution.

Additionally, the anecdotal information I have observed over decades is most investors with discount brokerage accounts appear to stay put with very little institution hopping, especially in registered accounts.

January 7, 2023
7:03 am
hwyc
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After a PM exchange with Loonie, I survey the big 6. Things are never simple where tax is charged, not even in the context of tax-free savings accounts sf-confused ... only half of them disclose a rather vague reference to tax in the vicinity.

  • CIBC $100
  • RBC $150
  • Scotia $100
  • TD $75 (Fee subject to applicable taxes)
  • BMO $50 (plus applicable taxes)
  • NA $86.97 +taxes/transfer

Is there someone who has a 1st person experience willing to share? Originally I thought financial services are exempted from GST. I may be wrong on this one now.

... @AltaRed #9 ... I meant to survey the banking side, savings accounts & not GICs

January 7, 2023
7:33 am
AltaRed
BC Interior
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While exempt from GST, some provinces may charge provincial sales taxes, such as BC's PST. BC does not have a combined HST (GST+PST).

Also, you may want to clarify that when you refer to the 6 banks, that you are indeed referring to their banking division, not their brokerage divisions.... e.g. Royal Bank rather than RBC corporately.

January 7, 2023
9:00 am
Bill
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I believe the GST or HST exemption applies to the actual transaction, i.e. the buy or sell of a financial instrument. A fee to transfer an account is something else, not related to buying or selling a financial instrument, thus is subject to the GST or HST. Is my understanding.

January 7, 2023
12:36 pm
Loonie
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I don't think they are obliged to disclose the tax in advance. As with any other purchase; it just shows up on your bill. They may not feel it's in their best interests to tell you in advance as it gives you more to complain about. On the other hand, they may judge that it's best to tell you in advance so that you will have fewer surprises to complain about. Or maybe they never thought about it much at all.

January 7, 2023
2:11 pm
AltaRed
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I don't think they are obliged to disclose taxes either. It is implicit to the consumer that VAT may apply. It will not change/affect the decision a consumer will make anyway

January 9, 2023
1:52 pm
butterflycharm
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A column for how long it takes to transfer it out is needed.

January 9, 2023
4:40 pm
hwyc
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I don't think so. It's a matter between a combination of two FIs. It would be futile. It may be better to hear it directly from your FIs and then hold them responsible to that timeframe.

January 10, 2023
9:14 am
butterflycharm
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hwyc said
I don't think so. It's a matter between a combination of two FIs. It would be futile. It may be better to hear it directly from your FIs and then hold them responsible to that timeframe.  

hold them responsible? lol

January 10, 2023
10:12 am
Loonie
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Agree with hwyc.

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