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Tang - Validated your actual interest rate?
June 2, 2016
11:26 am
jaybee
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Hi, New to this forum & joined see if I'm the only one trying to figure out HOW they calculate the interest.
I'm getting the 2.4% promo (apparently).
Looking at May, opening balance of 500k, I should be getting 32.97 per day interest, or 1022 per month(31 days), but getting $878 - that's $143 less. (~ 4.5 days lost interest) - a big gap..
I know they pay "base" (0.8) interest one day then the promo the next, so there's some fudging, but these numbers don't make sense.

Has anyone validated the interest they are actually getting?
What am I missing?

Thx

June 2, 2016
2:04 pm
james1900
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Jaybee, did you get two items of interest, first for 0.8% base and second the promotional 1.6%?

June 2, 2016
2:20 pm
jaybee
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Yes. They pay the "base" rate of .8% and the promo of 1.6% the following day.

June 2, 2016
2:27 pm
2of3aintbad
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Yes, I have validated the interest calculation over several months. The key question is, "Were you eligible for the 2.4% for the entire month?". If yes, then the bonus interest will be 2x the regular interest, regardless of deposits and withdrawals (because 1.6% is 2 x 0.8%). So if no withdrawals / deposits in the month, for $500,000, total interest should be $1016.40:

1. regular interest = $500,000 x 0.8% x 31/366 = $338.80.

2. bonus interest = $500,000 x 1.6% x 31/366 = $677.60.

June 2, 2016
3:01 pm
Loonie
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I had a similar question with a previous Tang promo, and it took me forever to figure out how they'd done it as it didn't make sense to me. Eventually, with the help of Norman1, I figured it out, and they were right. Perhaps you can find that thread here somewhere. it would have been at least a year ago. The whole tale is outlined in our back-and-forth.

Since then, I haven't bothered. It's very confusing because the last-day-of-month interest is based on that month, and the first-day-of-month is based on the previous month, so that adding together the total amount received in a given month doesn't mean anything or appear to be the rate you thought you were getting. And if you have one of those promos that only pays extra on the surplus above start point, it's even worse.

I have no idea why they make it so complicated and difficult to follow.

June 2, 2016
7:05 pm
Norman1
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Loonie said

I had a similar question with a previous Tang promo, and it took me forever to figure out how they'd done it as it didn't make sense to me. Eventually, with the help of Norman1, I figured it out, and they were right. Perhaps you can find that thread here somewhere. it would have been at least a year ago. The whole tale is outlined in our back-and-forth.

I remember that. That mystery with the 3%-for-180-days offer was solved around this post last summer.

It turned out that Tangerine gave you a slightly different 3%-for-180-days offer. Most people were given 1.05% regular interest + 1.95% Additional Interest. You had 1.75% regular interest + 1.25% Additional Interest.

June 2, 2016
7:10 pm
Norman1
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jaybee said

Hi, New to this forum & joined see if I'm the only one trying to figure out HOW they calculate the interest.

I'm getting the 2.4% promo (apparently).

Check the terms of your 2.4% offer, including start and end dates and whether the offer is for new money or entire balance. A previous post from 2of3aintbad give details on how to do this.

June 3, 2016
11:09 am
jaybee
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2of3aintbad said

Yes, I have validated the interest calculation over several months. The key question is, "Were you eligible for the 2.4% for the entire month?". If yes, then the bonus interest will be 2x the regular interest, regardless of deposits and withdrawals (because 1.6% is 2 x 0.8%). So if no withdrawals / deposits in the month, for $500,000, total interest should be $1016.40:

1. regular interest = $500,000 x 0.8% x 31/366 = $338.80.

2. bonus interest = $500,000 x 1.6% x 31/366 = $677.60.

2of3 - thanks for the calc. Q: why did you use 366 days in the year?

June 3, 2016
11:29 am
jaybee
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Norman1 said

jaybee said

Hi, New to this forum & joined see if I'm the only one trying to figure out HOW they calculate the interest....

Check the terms of your 2.4% offer, including start and end dates and whether the offer is for new money or entire balance. A previous post from 2of3aintbad give details on how to do this.

Thanks to all who have responded and the pointers to last years posts regarding a similar issue.
My scenario is quite simple compared to last year's discussion.

I joined for the 2.4% promo - no prior money, only one promotion, no overlaps.
Since the promo max is 500K, each month I move the interest gained over 500K to another account, so starting balance is always 500k.
I've checked the T's & C's... snips here..~~~~~~~~~

“Additional Interest” is 1.60% for Applicable Accounts. Additional Interest is added to the Bank’s applicable posted rate of interest listed on the Bank’s website to calculate the total amount of interest payable under this Offer. For example, Posted Rate of 0.80% on Tangerine Savings Accounts + Additional Interest of 1.60% = Offer rate of 2.40% (example uses interest rates current as of September 1, 2015). Eligible Clients receive Additional Interest on deposits to Applicable Accounts during the Promotion Period. Interest is paid through two separate interest payments, one based on the Posted Rate and a second based on the Additional Interest.... Yep, got that...,
Additional Interest will be paid on the first $500,000... - OK

Interest is calculated daily and paid monthly for both the Posted Rate interest payments and the Additional Interest payments. Additional Interest will not be paid until the start of the month following the month in which it was calculated, and the Additional Interest calculation for that month will not include Posted Rate interest paid on the previous day .... so they are saying that base rate (0.8) is paid 1 day, promo rate (1.6%) is paid next day but does not include the interest paid the previous day.... ok

the numbers 2of3 calculated are very close to mine (1016 vs 1022) and are pretty far from Tang's 878.61. I've called & CSR submitted a "ticket" to marketing to explain.... awaiting a response., any other thoughts appreciated... will update y'all...
Thanks

June 3, 2016
1:35 pm
2of3aintbad
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jaybee said

2of3aintbad said

Yes, I have validated the interest calculation over several months. The key question is, "Were you eligible for the 2.4% for the entire month?". If yes, then the bonus interest will be 2x the regular interest, regardless of deposits and withdrawals (because 1.6% is 2 x 0.8%). So if no withdrawals / deposits in the month, for $500,000, total interest should be $1016.40:

1. regular interest = $500,000 x 0.8% x 31/366 = $338.80.

2. bonus interest = $500,000 x 1.6% x 31/366 = $677.60.

2of3 - thanks for the calc. Q: why did you use 366 days in the year?

2016 is a leap year, and some institutions (Tangerine included based on my May interest) use 366 days in their calculations.

June 3, 2016
7:17 pm
Norman1
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jaybee said


I joined for the 2.4% promo - no prior money, only one promotion, no overlaps.
Since the promo max is 500K, each month I move the interest gained over 500K to another account, so starting balance is always 500k.

the numbers 2of3 calculated are very close to mine (1016 vs 1022) and are pretty far from Tang's 878.61. I've called & CSR submitted a "ticket" to marketing to explain.... awaiting a response., any other thoughts appreciated... will update y'all...
Thanks

You made some withdrawals!

Would your Tangerine offer have something like Condition 12 we found in a previous Tangerine offer?

12. All interest payments are ineligible for the purposes of calculating Additional Interest and will not be calculated for the purposes of determining eligible daily balances. ....

That condition seem to have the effect of treating any withdrawals as withdrawals against deposits that are eligible for Additional Interest. In other words, any withdrawals are withdrawals of principal and not of earned interest!

James had contacted Tangerine and confirmed that was the case.

June 4, 2016
7:07 am
2of3aintbad
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if only the interest was withdrawn, that would surely not make the difference of $143 in OP.

June 4, 2016
9:19 am
jaybee
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Norman1 said

You made some withdrawals!

Would your Tangerine offer have something like Condition 12 we found in a previous Tangerine offer?

12. All interest payments are ineligible for the purposes of calculating Additional Interest and will not be calculated for the purposes of determining eligible daily balances. ....

That condition seem to have the effect of treating any withdrawals as withdrawals against deposits that are eligible for Additional Interest. In other words, any withdrawals are withdrawals of principal and not of earned interest!

James had contacted Tangerine and confirmed that was the case.

Norman1... Thanks for the pointer.. I checked the Ts&Cs for the wording you noted & did not find any such wording.

June 4, 2016
11:52 am
Norman1
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jaybee said

Norman1... Thanks for the pointer.. I checked the Ts&Cs for the wording you noted & did not find any such wording.

Very odd!

What is the breakdown, regular interest and bonus interest, of the $878.61 interest received for May?

I would like to see if it bears any resemblance to the what 2of3aintbad calculated. Perhaps we can deduce what Tangerine's computers are thinking:

2of3aintbad said

1. regular interest = $500,000 x 0.8% x 31/366 = $338.80.
2. bonus interest = $500,000 x 1.6% x 31/366 = $677.60.

June 4, 2016
12:32 pm
Norman1
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I checked my Tangerine Savings Account. It's currently under a 2%-on-entire-balance offer.

Nothing unusual. The two interest payments for the month of May are within ⅛¢ of my calculations.

June 7, 2016
2:48 pm
jaybee
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Norman1 said

Very odd!

What is the breakdown, regular interest and bonus interest, of the $878.61 interest received for May?

I would like to see if it bears any resemblance to the what 2of3aintbad calculated. Perhaps we can deduce what Tangerine's computers are thinking:

2of3aintbad said

1. regular interest = $500,000 x 0.8% x 31/366 = $338.80.
2. bonus interest = $500,000 x 1.6% x 31/366 = $677.60.

Here's the statement data:
31-May-2016 Interest Paid 338.80
1-Jun-2016 Promotional Bonus Interest 539.81
Balance May1 was 500k
So - looks like the promo interest is wrong.
I caled Tang, they submitted a "ticket" to marketing & CSR said a response in 2 bus days.
Called yesterday for an update & now CSR says 5 business days for a response.... Pretty poor response time for an "customer service award winning" company

June 7, 2016
4:11 pm
dentgal
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I think that you can make withdrawals with the promotional interest. The promotional interest is in the NEW money that you put it (so if you had ZERO to start, then your whole $500K should get promotional interest. I'm pretty sure that they calculate daily interest on the account.

June 7, 2016
5:08 pm
Norman1
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2of3aintbad said

1. regular interest = $500,000 x 0.8% x 31/366 = $338.80.
2. bonus interest = $500,000 x 1.6% x 31/366 = $677.60.

jaybee said
Here's the statement data:
31-May-2016 Interest Paid 338.80
1-Jun-2016 Promotional Bonus Interest 539.81
Balance May1 was 500k
So - looks like the promo interest is wrong.
I caled Tang, they submitted a "ticket" to marketing & CSR said a response in 2 bus days.
Called yesterday for an update & now CSR says 5 business days for a response.... Pretty poor response time for an "customer service award winning" company

$338.80 of regular 0.8% interest is correct. The confirms the balance was $500,000 for the month of May.

$539.81 of bonus interests suggests

  1. $398,327.54 x 1.60000% x 31/366,
  2. $500,000.00 x 1.27465% x 31/366, or
  3. $500,000.00 x 1.60000% x 24.6963/366

Those are really odd possibilities for the amount, rate, and number of days!

Tangerine may have a bug in their computer system!sf-surprised

June 8, 2016
6:17 pm
Norman1
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jaybee said
Here's the statement data:
31-May-2016 Interest Paid 338.80
1-Jun-2016 Promotional Bonus Interest 539.81
Balance May1 was 500k
So - looks like the promo interest is wrong.

Norman1 said

$338.80 of regular 0.8% interest is correct. The confirms the balance was $500,000 for the month of May.

$539.81 of bonus interests suggests

  1. $398,327.54 x 1.60000% x 31/366,
  2. $500,000.00 x 1.27465% x 31/366, or
  3. $500,000.00 x 1.60000% x 24.6963/366

I've been thinking about the three possibilities.

#2 is unlikely. Not likely Tangerine would get the interest rate wrong.
#3 is unlikely. Not likely Tangerine would get the wrong number of days in May.

That leaves #1. Do you have another Tangerine savings account that qualifies for the 2.4% offer?

Another Tangerine savings account, single or joint, that has a balance of $500,000 - $398,327.54 = $101,672.46 could explain it.

June 12, 2016
11:08 am
jaybee
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That leaves #1. Do you have another Tangerine savings account that qualifies for the 2.4% offer?

Another Tangerine savings account, single or joint, that has a balance of $500,000 - $398,327.54 = $101,672.46 could explain it.
Norman1- You cracked it!
yes, wife (primary on joint acct) has savings as well with the 101k.
I called Tang AGAIN (what a frustrating experience! - front line CSRs just make stuff up when they dont know the answer) - kinda went ballistic, got a supervisor who exactly described the scenario, primary on joint and the primary's savings account are linked (for total of 601k) & that kicks the account over 500k...
I explained that that's not what CSRs at Tang told us when we opened accounts... Also that if we balanced the assests, we are under 500k each.
He thought he might be able to get them (Tang) to make things right & apply the 2.4% across the account,s since , essentially, the dollars are just allocated incorrectly across accounts. That is a good answer & I hope that happens.....

I Really have to wonder WHY Tang makes it all so complicated!?
For example, I looked that the cash back Credit card & the arbitrary categories, which are assigned by the merchant - for example, Costco charges do not fit into a category -regardless of what you buy. Why Tangerine, Why make it soo complicated? How can anyone audit their cashback?
Just give cash back on total purchases & make it easy to do business with Tangerine!
Stop the "out of control" Marketing nonsense...
(there - I feel better...) :-)

BTW - will update forum with final response from Tang re: 2.4%
Thanks all...

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