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Calling It - Tangerine ending quarterly promo rates?
October 3, 2017
11:27 am
Doug
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As we're now into the second business day of a new calendar quarter and the only promotional savings rate of interest available is a 1.90%/2.40% (with chequing account opening) for new clients only indicates new & quasi-anonymous CEO Rideout has made the decision to end Tangerine's regular quarterly bonus rates of interest. I think she's making a qualified decision but a "gamble" nonetheless that by raising the posted rate to 1% with the two recent BoC rate rises, that Tangerine is again "competitive" relative to the Big 5 banks and that, while they may see some decline in HISA deposit balances, it will not be overly material (i.e., less than 5% of their $30 billion in deposits, or $1.5 billion) and she's willing to take that loss and focus on new client acquisition. Plus, they've aggressively ramped up the Tangerine index mutual funds offering with both an e-mail and snail mail marketing campaign this quarter. 🙂

With that, let's "light a candle" and a tribute to Savings Sales, it was fun while it lasted, but let's seek out the best rates elsewhere, namely the likes of Hubert Financial, Implicity Financial, EQ Bank and Alterna Bank, to name my "top picks". 😉

Retention rates will likely still continue but which may preclude you from future Savings Sales, should they be re-instituted and will generally be in the 2-2.25% range, possibly as high as the 2.40% available to new clients only. 🙂

With that little of a difference and Tangerine's other negative changes vis a vis their credit card product and shrinking Scotiabank ABM Network, I'm happy to "give up" 15 bps with EQ Bank or even more with a Hubert or Implicity, who provide exceptional customer service.

Cheers,
Doug

October 3, 2017
12:12 pm
Loonie
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This is more or less what I've been thinking over the last week or two.
Happy to be proven wrong in some respects, but, on the other hand, would be glad to not have to occupy any more time or energy thinking about how to outwit the Tang "system".

October 3, 2017
12:29 pm
Brimleychen
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Loonie said
This is more or less what I've been thinking over the last week or two.
Happy to be proven wrong in some respects, but, on the other hand, would be glad to not have to occupy any more time or energy thinking about how to outwit the Tang "system".  

Parking with PCF at 2.5% (until the end of Oct) after Tang promotion. I will probably use Meridian 2.5% for 90 days. Otherwise I will use EQ Bank @2.3%.

I will be very patient to play this game with PCF and Tang.sf-laugh

Nothing to lose here.

Actually I celebrated many chunks of 5 year GICs at 3.5% with Oaken/HomeBank during the summer. That's to avoid 3.22% Tang's catch for short term.

October 3, 2017
1:11 pm
Bill
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Doug, you're already wrong on at least one count, i.e. retention rates will peak at 2.25%, 2.4% for new clients only. Some folks on here, as well as my Mom, recently got 2.5% retention rate for 90 days with no difficulty. (Also your claim that Ms Rideout is "quasi-anonymous" - not sure why the personal insinuation is needed - ? - seems to be unsupported by any evidence that she is less visible or approachable than other bank CEOs.) As for rates, you may be right but we'll see what happens in the next few days. I wouldn't scurry off to other institutions just yet, there's no hurry.

October 3, 2017
1:43 pm
DavidAlta13
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The previous two quarters' topics are clear that Tang's promo / retention offers are Not made until the 5th calendar day of the new quarter.
So "calling it" before that is premature. We won't know until Oct 5.

October 3, 2017
1:59 pm
Loonie
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He was just making a prediction, not saying it was a done deal, as I read it - the title had a question mark at the end.
My suspicion is based on the fact that there was a remarkable lower-end consistency in offers received last week. They were all 2.5, for those who received them, as I recall. My intuition suggested that might be the harbinger of things to come. I could be wrong.
We'll see! Many more fish in the pond anyway.

October 3, 2017
2:12 pm
fabafter50
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Just signed up with WealthOne, nice and easy process, mobile cheque deposit with 2.5% savings account.
I'm also in P.C until the end of October. Oaken rates have dropped so at least there is somewhere to park it at a decent interest rate until something exciting comes along.
I wouldn't hold my breath on Tangerine, their lottery style of banking is truly annoying unless you are one of the winners getting the high offers.

October 3, 2017
4:20 pm
GreatWhiteNorth
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Loonie said
He was just making a prediction, not saying it was a done deal, as I read it - the title had a question mark at the end.
  

Well, not really. He's represented it as a done deal and postulated widely from there.

Seems strange to me as we're still days short of Ting's recently normal monthly schedule so maybe he has some inside insights.

Recent retention offers of 2.5 & 2.75% exceed those of the past few rounds but I wouldn't necessarily read anything into that either.

As always, ... we'll see.

October 3, 2017
4:53 pm
Top It Up
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GreatWhiteNorth said

Well, not really. He's represented it as a done deal and postulated widely from there.  

+1

October 4, 2017
5:35 am
Rick
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fall
So much for that theory.

October 4, 2017
9:29 am
Doug
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Bill said
Doug, you're already wrong on at least one count, i.e. retention rates will peak at 2.25%, 2.4% for new clients only. Some folks on here, as well as my Mom, recently got 2.5% retention rate for 90 days with no difficulty. (Also your claim that Ms Rideout is "quasi-anonymous" - not sure why the personal insinuation is needed - ? - seems to be unsupported by any evidence that she is less visible or approachable than other bank CEOs.) As for rates, you may be right but we'll see what happens in the next few days. I wouldn't scurry off to other institutions just yet, there's no hurry.  

First, I'm not necessarily wrong. I stated "retention rates" will continue but will be meagre, at best. They offer a meagre, if any, premium to the highest HISA rates of an EQ Bank, Meridian Credit Union short-term GICs or other. While it's true Tangerine has now come out with a promotion for the fall for today, notice the rate? 2.12% was what I, and my Mom, were offered - the lowest ever at a time when the BoC's Prime Rate is rising. On $125-150,000, that's a modest premium of ~$20-25 per 30-day month over Hubert and Implicity's 1.85% rate. Compared to others, it's even less. So, somewhat quixotically, what we're actually seeing here is the "retention rates" now exceeding, possibly for the first time ever, the seasonal promotional rates. This is not markedly different from what I said in my original post. Tangerine's basically got to offer a premium of 25 basis points over the highest HISA account rate on the market for me to keep my money there going forward. Might I open another savings account with another FI? Perhaps. Does it mean I'm going to leave Tangerine completely? No, likely not. I'll keep them for a chequing account, for a credit card I rarely use since they unilaterally and unfairly lowered the "all other purchases" reward value ratio to 0.5% in the spring and a small amount in savings (i.e., $5-10,000). No longer will I show them extra loyalty - I'll basically "use and abuse" them for the Scotiabank ABM network, free email money transfers and where cheques are required. Now...if Simplii were to keep free cheque orders and add free Interac e-Transfers, that changes the whole ballgame instantly. 🙂

As for Ms. Rideout, I won't waste any more "airtime" on her but, suffice it to say, just try and find a Twitter profile or Facebook page. Try and find a biography for her on Tangerine's website. Try and find a blog post authored by her. Try and find how she is continuing to emulate Mr. Aceto's & Mr. Cunningham's forward-thinking (ironically, the title of Tangerine's own blog, or at least it was prior to the website overhaul) & superior leadership style. You won't. She's anonymous, faceless, even, the only picture(s) of her are available on one or two banking industry trade publication articles on her. And, I don't completely fault her for that - it's by design. She's a "yes man" or a "yes ma'am" to her corporate overseers in the EVP of Domestic Retail Distribution, James McPhedran, and SEVP & Group Head Canadian Banking, James O'Sullivan, with Scotiabank.

Cheers,
Doug

October 4, 2017
9:36 am
Doug
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Loonie, thanks for your clarification of my original post. My post did qualify the title with a question mark and it absolutely was a prediction. And, while I was partially wrong on a fall promo offer coming around, I wasn't completely wrong either. For perhaps the first time in its history, retention offers are exceeding the promo offers. And, another important point, if the BoC raises rates and Tangerine follows again, a "tricky" thing they do: the bonus rates in effect don't rise. One would think they would with the Posted Rate portion rising but, as I saw in July, another thing that "soured" me somewhat, they used a clause in their three- or four-page long Terms & Conditions that allows them to manipulate the Additional Interest Rate such that the current rate offer remains in effect. 😉

fabafter50, well said. I hadn't realized WealthOne was now offering HISAs, ostensibly with fully online account opening until someone (possibly you) posted earlier this quarter that they were and they are remarkably competitive. 🙂

Tangerine "fanboys" clearly still exist but consider this onetime "fanboy" to be now a Tangerine "user" from a Tangerine "loyalist". They'll get my chequing business, maybe a few thousand in savings as a "cushion," but that's it.

They've also got to fix significant online and core banking system errors, too!

Cheers,
Doug

October 4, 2017
9:45 am
Doug
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GreatWhiteNorth said

Well, not really. He's represented it as a done deal and postulated widely from there.

Seems strange to me as we're still days short of Ting's recently normal monthly schedule so maybe he has some inside insights.

Recent retention offers of 2.5 & 2.75% exceed those of the past few rounds but I wouldn't necessarily read anything into that either.

As always, ... we'll see.  

"Inside insights"? I hope you're not insinuating anything and that that is mere sarcasm because it's not clear to me. Nope, sorry, while I own BNS shares from 2007 and which I haven't sold but am re-evaluating particularly on the way BNS is handling & "mucking with" Tangerine to try and squeeze extra profits from only modestly increasing revenues, I don't work for them and don't contract for them. 🙂

Also, when how is postulated, as you put it, not predicted? 😉

Cheers,
Doug

October 4, 2017
10:07 am
Rick
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Well from what I am reading, retention rates were 2, 2.15 or 2.5%, while promos are showing up at mostly 2.75 with some 2.5's. So yeah...you kinda were wrong. Promo rates are, once again, at least equal and seems like, better than promo rates by somewhere between 0 and .75%. The gap is closing a bit, but historically,for the last couple years, as shown on this forum repeatedly, the average promo rate exceeds the retention rate. At 2.75, the rate is better than EQ, PC or anyone's HISA rate by at least .25 to .5%. And no....I am not a Tang "fanboy". They lost the VAST majority of my registered savings shortly after ING sold them. But if they want to pay me to keep a small portion of my banking business, I'll bite. The promo rate gets any closer to EQ's I will reconsider them as I have more faith in EQ than Tang. I hold no loyalty to Tang. You get what you give and they have repeatedly demonstrated they don't care if I stay or leave.

October 4, 2017
10:11 am
Doug
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Rick said
Well from what I am reading, retention rates were 2, 2.15 or 2.5%, while promos are showing up at mostly 2.75 with some 2.5's. So yeah...you kinda were wrong. Promo rates are, once again, at least equal and seems like, better than promo rates by somewhere between 0 and .75%. The gap is closing a bit, but historically,for the last couple years, as shown on this forum repeatedly, the average promo rate exceeds the retention rate. At 2.75, the rate is better than EQ, PC or anyone's HISA rate by at least .25 to .5%. And no....I am not a Tang "fanboy". They lost the VAST majority of my registered savings shortly after ING sold them. But if they want to pay me to keep a small portion of my banking business, I'll bite. The promo rate gets any closer to EQ's I will reconsider them as I have more faith in EQ than Tang. I hold no loyalty to Tang. You get what you give and they have repeatedly demonstrated they don't care if I stay or leave.  

No, that's the opposite of what I've been reading. Look again - others posted, in this thread, that retention rates are 2.25-2.5, as much as 2.75%.

Promo rates are 2.10-2.50, at most. That's what's been posted anyway. 🙂

Loonie, what'd you get? Your promo rate offers, like mine, are always a reasonable approximation. Likewise, Peter, what'd you get?

Cheers,
Doug

October 4, 2017
10:16 am
Rick
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Doug said
Also, when how is postulated, as you put it, not predicted? 😉

Cheers,
Doug  

postulated: Something assumed without proof as being self-evident or generally accepted, especially when used as a basis for an argument

predicted: That which has been foretold.

You have to be right to say you predicted it.

October 4, 2017
10:20 am
Peter
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I got 2.75% this quarter; more details in the retention thread.

October 4, 2017
10:30 am
Rick
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Doug said

No, that's the opposite of what I've been reading. Look again - others posted, in this thread, that retention rates are 2.25-2.5, as much as 2.75%.

Promo rates are 2.10-2.50, at most. That's what's been posted anyway. 🙂

Loonie, what'd you get? Your promo rate offers, like mine, are always a reasonable approximation. Likewise, Peter, what'd you get?

Cheers,
Doug  

I count 12 people so far getting 2.75 and 2 got 2.55 promo rates. Don't see anyone with 2.1 or 2.5 in this thread at all. In the Q4 promo thread I see 3 people were offered 2.5 retention. Lowest promo offer I've seen so far is 2.55 percent....STILL better than 2.5. Promo rates are MOSTLY 2.75...are you confusing promo and retention rates?

October 4, 2017
11:00 am
tcharger67
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i checked my tangerine bonus, also contacted chat. As a new customer i still fall under the intro 2.4% and do not qualify for any new promo rates until feb 3 2018 after my 6 month promo ends

October 4, 2017
11:19 am
Keith1
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I never moved any money and received the fall promotion for 2.75% till Dec 31th on new money only. Called and asked for a retention rate and received 2.5% until Dec 31th on my entire balance. Based on the balance already there and no need to move money out and in I accepted.

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