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Sunova Credit Union 2018 annual dividend payment
May 28, 2019
12:50 pm
Doug
British Columbia, Canada
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Hi everyone,

I happened to take a routine point-in-time calculation of my net worth today as I hadn't done it in probably 8 months or so, so thought I'd check on my Hubert 2018 dividend payment. Indeed, it was just paid to my Hubert surplus share account in the amount of $5.25. I have 20 x $5.00 shares in my share account totaling $100.00, plus a previous balance (as at December 31, 2018) in my surplus account of $24.52. Looking at Sunova's updated dividend payment history, posted today here, the dividend rate as set by the Board was 4.92% for 2018, up from 4.27% in 2017.

However, when I calculate $100.00 x $0.0492 and $24.52 x $0.0492, I get a combined total of $6.13, a difference of $0.88. Not a huge difference, but if I had more shares, it would make more of a difference. Has anyone else noticed a discrepancy in one, or probably all, years, or, if not, what's the correct calculation method (i.e., what's wrong)? My formulas are sound, but wondering where the calculation is different.

I just want to make sure the calculation and posting is accurate before I buy more shares (would love to buy, at a minimum, the 100 shares each member is limited to buying or, if they do a capital raise, I'd potentially like to buy between $5,000 and $10,000 in shares).

Cheers,
Doug

May 28, 2019
1:03 pm
Doug
British Columbia, Canada
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I just checked my share surplus account again and, indeed, 2018's dividend of 4.92% hasn't yet been posted to my account. However, even using the 2017 year-end balance of $24.52 quoted above and my static $100.00 share balance and the 2017 dividend rate of 4.27%, it still looks like I was shorted, albeit by only about $0.07 - $5.32 to $5.25 that was paid).

I find their dividend payment methodology rather opaque! I hope they're not shorting clients. 🙁

Cheers,
Doug

May 28, 2019
1:12 pm
Yatti420
Canada
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I haven't been paid out since my account went dormant in 2017..Its active again now.. I was waiting for this year to see what happens..

May 28, 2019
2:49 pm
Doug
British Columbia, Canada
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Yatti420 said
I haven't been paid out since my account went dormant in 2017..Its active again now.. I was waiting for this year to see what happens..  

That shouldn't affect your dividend payment, though. And the surplus account can't go dormant (or at least it should) since you can't "withdraw" or "deposit" to it self-serve.

If anyone can figure out their methodology, that'd be great. Hubert's hold times and live chat wait times seems to have crept up to 15+ minutes. 🙁

Cheers,
Doug

May 28, 2019
6:23 pm
Doug
British Columbia, Canada
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This just in: Sunova Credit Union has announced an additional investment share purchase opportunity of up to $100,000 shares ($5.00 par value) will be launched on June 1, 2019. I want to make sure I've been credited the correct amount before I dive in, but definitely planning to buy $5,000-10,000 this time.

Dividend yield has been 4-5.5% annually for each of the past fifteen years or so.

As always, shares are not guaranteed by DGCM, but are redeemable with approval of the Board of Directors in future years at their par value.

Cheers,
Doug

May 29, 2019
9:34 am
Shawguy
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I only purchased $1000 on shares on November 1, and I got $8.22 this morning in the surplus share account.

May 29, 2019
10:11 am
Doug
British Columbia, Canada
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Thanks, Shawguy. Yes, I just concluded a live chat with Gisele, a Hubert CSR, who was actually finally able to clarify the myserious dividend payment calculation methodology.

I had thought, or understood from previous conversations with Hubert, that it was based on my December 31 previous year-end share and surplus balances. However, it's actually calculated on your daily based on your end of month share and surplus balances.

The following redacted transcript illustrates this by way of an example of my 2018 dividend payment yesterday evening of $6.30:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1COWNw6lChUaKd1gwrPJ0rFQFm5c-L3Ao

Peter may want to also pin this thread to the Hubert Financial forum since we've finally solved the mystery.

So, in your example, you'd get the dividend payment on $1000.00 from November 1, 2018, through April 30, 2019, and on $5.00 from May 1, 2018, through October 31, 2018.

Cheers,
Doug

May 29, 2019
1:54 pm
Yatti420
Canada
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I still haven't received any payout.. I just looked and I actually haven't received any dividend payout since May 2014.. Before my account went inactive.. Here is a basic breakdown... I also had about 5 shares since around Dec 2012 time frame.. Also another added Mar 5 2015 for 6 total. Not alot but not 1 either. So very confused..

2011 - Opened July 15 2011 - Dividend payout for 2011 > Received Dec 15 2012. (1 share)
2012 - Dividend payout for 2012 - Received Dec 29 2013. (5 shares)
2013 - May 2014 Statement indicates payout for 2012? Received May 5 2014.
2014 - Nothing
2015 - Nothing (6 shares)
2016 - Nothing - Account "gets paid out" / dormant Aug 2016.
2017 - Account restored in March 2017.
2018 - Nothing

May 29, 2019
1:56 pm
Shawguy
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Yatti420 said
I still haven't received any payout.. I just looked and I actually haven't received any dividend payout since May 2014.. Before my account went inactive.. Here is a basic breakdown...

2011 - Opened July 15 2011 - Dividend payout for 2011 > Received Dec 15 2012.
2012 - Dividend payout for 2012 - Received Dec 29 2013.
2013 - May 2014 Statement indicates payout for 2012? Received May 5 2014.
2014 - Nothing
2015 - Nothing
2016 - Nothing - Account "gets paid out" / dormant Aug 2016.
2017 - Account restored in March 2017.
2018 - Nothing  

Do you have more than just the initial $5 share. I believe since 2014 they don't pay anything if you only have the $5 share - you would have to had purchased more shares.

May 29, 2019
2:01 pm
Yatti420
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Yep I do.. Not alot but not 1 share either.. I heard they aren't paying out on "Single Shares?" Makes no sense really as you can get partial surplus shares.. This was also never disclosed or voted on (outside of management) as far as I know.

May 29, 2019
2:36 pm
Doug
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That's strange, Yatti. I would definitely reach out to Hubert via Live Chat, but from the sounds of it, you've averaged 4-6 shares ($20-30). Assuming a 4.5% dividend rate, that works out to ~$1.12, which supposedly would be paid to your surplus account. I wonder if they don't pay out anything under $5.00? It could be in the fine print, which they don't post on their website unfortunately. 🙁

The rules re: payment of dividends may have been established and not changed since before you and I became members through Hubert.

My payments seem to be paid as promised now that I know how they're calculated (average $5.25 per year since 2013, on 20 x $5.00 shares)

Cheers,
Doug

June 1, 2019
3:48 am
Canadianbull
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Questions:
what is the procedure if I want to sell their shares?
Is it safe to buy their shares?
What is the procedure if I want to buy their shares?
Any help is appreciated!

June 1, 2019
11:14 am
gicjunkie
Ontario
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Canadianbull said
Questions:
what is the procedure if I want to sell their shares?
Is it safe to buy their shares?
What is the procedure if I want to buy their shares?
Any help is appreciated!  

All the details are here:

https://www.sunovacu.ca/personal/banking/member-share-program/

June 1, 2019
11:36 am
Yatti420
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$2.50 is the minimum dividend required (per CSR Chat) for payout per the new bylaws etc.. I can't find the change though in documentation.. I'll look later!

June 1, 2019
12:06 pm
Shawguy
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Above someone mentioned the "partial shares" and that a dividend would not be paid out on that. As I have accounts at both Hubert and Sunova, I can expand a little on that. It doesn't affect people on the Hubert side as you can only purchase whole shares ($5 a share), but on the Sunova side if you have less than $1000 in shares in your share account, you are required to buy a 1/2 share every month ($2.50) that gets deducted from your chequing or savings account and it goes into a third share account (you won't see this on Hubert, only if you have Sunova), and then every second month (aka once that account reaches $5), it transfers the $5 to the share account to purchase an additional share. The system will do this until you have reached the maximum of $1000.

On the Sunova side, I didn't want to have to worry about $2.50 being deducted from my account every month so I just purchased $1000 in shares last year to stop that deduction on my Sunova account.

As you can see this doesn't apply to Hubert members because they are only required to purchase 1 share at $5 and it is their choice if they want to purchase additional shares.

June 2, 2019
6:51 pm
Norman1
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Yatti420 said
$2.50 is the minimum dividend required (per CSR Chat) for payout per the new bylaws etc.. I can't find the change though in documentation.. I'll look later!

I found a copy of Sunova's bylaws (April 2017) as part of the February 2018 Amalgamation Agreement between Sunova CU and Oakbank CU.

There is a $2.50 minimum mentioned in 3.03 for patronage refunds:

Small patronage refund not credited

3.03 Where a patronage refund that would otherwise be payable to a member in respect of the operations of a fiscal year is less than $2.50 no patronage refund shall be credit to that member for that fiscal year, but shall be the property of the credit union to be used as the directors may decide.

I didn't see any minimum for dividends on the common or surplus shares.

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