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CIDC limits: GICs within RRSP Brokerage Acct.
November 14, 2022
12:55 pm
Norman1
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fs2schm said

… if the GIC is held in a registered account at a discount brokerage in-nominee-name, it would fall under the limit of that deposit category for that GIC issuer (e.g., the RRSP category of EQ Bank in the case of AuntiD), rather than the separate trust category that is available for non-registered accounts.

Scotia iTRADE does not sell RRSP/TFSA/RRIF GIC's.

They sell ordinary, non-registered GIC's that are then held in an RRSP trust. So, the CDIC trust category applies, not the CDIC RSP category.

Same with shares. If one buys Bank of Montreal shares in a Scotia iTRADE RRSP account, one isn't receiving special Bank of Montreal RRSP common shares. The shares are identical to the shares one would have if they were bought in a Scotia iTRADE non-registered account.

November 14, 2022
1:05 pm
fs2schm
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Norman1, thanks for the reply. Here is the excerpt from the CDIC page that is confusing:
"Coverage would be extended to these deposits under the trust deposits insurance category — except if they are held in a registered plan, such as an RRSP, RRIF, RESP, RDSP or a TFSA which are deposit categories in their own right and therefore each receive separate coverage of up to $100,000."
This seems to clearly say that the trust category does not apply "if they are held in a" registered account. But it is then unclear what is meant by "deposit categories in their own right". I interpreted that to mean that the limit then applies to the sum of all assets from a particular issuer within a given registered category (RRSP, RRIF, TFSA, etc.). Do you see an interpretation that would still treat it in the trust category?

November 14, 2022
2:10 pm
Bill
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This is very confusing. To me the question is, in the following scenario what CDIC coverage do I have?

In my own non-registered account with EQ Bank I have a $100K GIC. I have another $100K GIC at EQ Bank in my EQ Bank RRSP account. In addition, in my brokerage non-registered account at Scotia iTRADE I have a $100K EQ Bank GIC as well as another EQ Bank $100K GIC in my RRSP account at the same brokerage. What is the CDIC coverage I have?

November 14, 2022
5:20 pm
Norman1
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fs2schm said
Norman1, thanks for the reply. Here is the excerpt from the CDIC page that is confusing:
"Coverage would be extended to these deposits under the trust deposits insurance category — except if they are held in a registered plan, such as an RRSP, RRIF, RESP, RDSP or a TFSA which are deposit categories in their own right and therefore each receive separate coverage of up to $100,000."
This seems to clearly say that the trust category does not apply "if they are held in a" registered account. But it is then unclear what is meant by "deposit categories in their own right". …

That doesn't say the registered plans aren't in the trust deposits category.

The registered plans with a nominee will be in a separate trust category than the trust category for the non-registered accounts with the same nominee.

Alice will have two trusts when she has a regular account and a TFSA account with a broker that holds the investments in nominee form. One trust will be for the holdings in her regular account. The other TFSA trust will be for the holdings in her TFSA account.

CDIC considers the two trusts to be in different insurance categories.

November 14, 2022
5:37 pm
Norman1
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Bill said

In my own non-registered account with EQ Bank I have a $100K GIC. I have another $100K GIC at EQ Bank in my EQ Bank RRSP account. In addition, in my brokerage non-registered account at Scotia iTRADE I have a $100K EQ Bank GIC as well as another EQ Bank $100K GIC in my RRSP account at the same brokerage. What is the CDIC coverage I have?

I would guess $400,000:

Channel GIC Issuer GIC Type Registration Amount
EQ Bank Equitable Bank Individual Bill $100,000
Equitable Bank RRSP Bill $100,000
Scotia iTRADE Equitable Bank Trust iTRADE's nominee,
in trust for Bill
$100,000
Equitable Bank Trust Scotiatrust,
in trust for Bill (RRSP)
$100,000
November 14, 2022
5:55 pm
Bill
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Good, thanks, Norman1, that was what I was leaning to too.

November 15, 2022
7:05 am
hwyc
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Sorry, I understand the majority here (including myself) have no doubt these GIC deposits are CDIC covered.

I just bought one recently on TDDI. Along the purchase process, I did not encountered any written text mentioning CDIC insured. This morning, I do a word search on TD Waterhouse Canada Inc. Account and Services Agreements and Disclosure Documents & found this

The investment products sold by TDWCI are generally market priced and may fluctuate in value, based on market conditions . Unless we advise you otherwise with respect to a particular investment product, investment products sold by TDWCI are not insured by the Canadian Deposit Insurance Corporation or any other government deposit insurer and are not guaranteed .

Am I connecting the wrong dots?
Should I be concerned?

November 15, 2022
7:12 am
Bill
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It's a general statement about their products, "generally".

This might make you feel better:
https://www.td.com/ca/en/asset-management/documents/investor/pdf/TD%20ISA%20Product%20Features.pdf

November 15, 2022
7:19 am
hwyc
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Bill, but I thought this thread is not about the ISA(s). Also I am not talking about the ISA(s). It's the GICs under Research -> Investment -> GIC rate sheet

November 15, 2022
12:01 pm
Bill
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Sorry, you're right, I wasn't paying attention.

No, you shouldn't be concerned, GICs are covered under CDIC, with the limits as we've been discussing here, holding them in a Waterhouse account does not negate that. Not sure what their blurb means, seems to be just a reminder that stocks, etc, i.e. products that are "market priced" and that "fluctuate in value" (and that likely are the focus of most brokerage account investors), are "generally" not covered by CDIC.

November 15, 2022
12:31 pm
Norman1
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It is obvious what that means if the text is read in context:

Shared Premises: TDWCI [TD Waterhouse Canada Inc] may have an office in a location that is shared with The Toronto-Dominion Bank or its subsidiaries, including TD Canada Trust branches where it conducts its activities. Transactions governed by this Account and Services Agreement you make at those locations are between you and TDWCI. By entering into this agreement with TDWCI you are dealing with a separate organization whose products and services may differ from those associated with other entities, including TD Waterhouse Insurance Services Inc ., The Toronto-Dominion Bank, The Canada Trust Company, TD Investment Services Inc. and/or TD Waterhouse Private Investment Counsel Inc. The investment products sold by TDWCI are generally market priced and may fluctuate in value, based on market conditions. Unless we advise you otherwise with respect to a particular investment product, investment products sold by TDWCI are not insured by the Canadian Deposit Insurance Corporation or any other government deposit insurer and are not guaranteed.

November 15, 2022
2:04 pm
hwyc
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Norman1. You are right that I did not buy it on site at a TD bank location. On the other hand, TDDI did not explicitly disclose to me the product I bought meet the requirement for CDIC coverage along my purchase process.

I was hoping someone will point me to some applicable text on the TDDI site, or other equivalent brokerage site. That's all.

If the context of coverage is to be implicit without the need for TDDI's saying, I am moving along.

November 15, 2022
5:47 pm
Bill
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This page from TD DI re GICs indicates CDIC coverage:
https://www.td.com/ca/en/investing/direct-investing/investment-types/gics

November 23, 2022
9:09 am
TommyT
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COIN said
One side comment. They really need to raise the CDIC limit. That $100,000 limit was set many years ago and should now be increased to at least $250,000.  

You've got that right. $250,000 in America and Canada fell asleep at the wheel.

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